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Anti - Chase System - Bug Fix Idea


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Poll: Anti-Chase system (Full-Bind increase) (15 member(s) have cast votes)

How many Full-Binds should be allowed?

  1. 8 (2 votes [13.33%])

    Percentage of vote: 13.33%

  2. 10 (9 votes [60.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 60.00%

  3. 12 (2 votes [13.33%])

    Percentage of vote: 13.33%

  4. 15 (1 votes [6.67%])

    Percentage of vote: 6.67%

  5. More than 15 (1 votes [6.67%])

    Percentage of vote: 6.67%

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#1 HmmNess

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 10:24 AM

I have noticed people complaining about the new anti-chase system that has been implemented recently in game.  The main problem that I have noticed thus far, is that players are getting dinged for chasing normally into an opponent's camp.  This is not what the anti-chase rule was intended for.  The anti-chase rule is only supposed to stop players that are chasing pieces in circles inside of the same area.  As we all know, this sort of chasing can last forever until someone gives in.

 

The anti-chase system stops players from chasing in an endless loop after 5 Full-Binds.  After reviewing player's comments on the forums and experiencing how the new rule doesn't work correctly for myself, I have decided to create a poll on the forums.  A fix for this problem would be to allow 8 - 10 Full-Binds before getting prompted with a warning message.  I am willing to discuss this with the community to see if I can be convinced to perhaps change the Full-Bind amount allowed to an even higher number.

 

Any and all members may vote and add your comments to this post.  We should try to keep all anti-chase discussions inside of this post to keep the forums clean.

 

HmmNess


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#2 trickz

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 11:30 AM

Yo, it's true,...you can't chase your opponent.

If you've made too many blinds by chasing this rodent,

then you can't capture and take that piece his place in the moment! :angry:

HmmNess, you're the last hope,...you're the saver in Oakland

so you gotta save us the hopeless....games that are frozen,

the play? It is broken, the debate is still open

and it makes us ferocious to play games with the notion

that they lack the fokkin' basic components! :D

I know it's not your task but you're maybe devoted...

to fix this problem anyway so I'm beggin' mainly to focus

to erase these emotions by replacing this bogus!

The software's gotta be fixed by creating exponents

that allow you to chase your opponent,...

10 fullbinds will do the job and for this choice I'm the greatest proponent! ;)

 

I hope it will be fixed...

And for all the cheating foks,...well, I hope they fokkin' pay an atonement! :D


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#3 Kaamelott

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 01:39 PM

I vote 12. But the most important is that there are a limit, even thought it's a high limit.



#4 HmmNess

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 07:17 PM

Ya, we want enough room that you could chase, but not chase forever.

 

HmmNess


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#5 Midnightguy

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 07:26 PM

I voted for 10, but will to go 12.  A player should at least be able to make it to one side of the board to the other. 



#6 varishnakov

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 10:07 PM

I don't really like a limit to full binds. Just prebind fullbinds.


I have quit the site until the cheating players are dealt with.


#7 HmmNess

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 12:26 AM

I don't really like a limit to full binds. Just prebind fullbinds.

 

Full-binds can only be created if a pre-bind is created first.  So pre-bind / full-binds are one in the same.

 

HmmNess


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#8 HmmNess

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 12:26 AM

I moved my vote from 8 to 10.  I think 10 would be a good number as many of you have suggested.

 

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#9 varishnakov

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 01:16 AM

Full-binds can only be created if a pre-bind is created first.  So pre-bind / full-binds are one in the same.

 

HmmNess

What about when a piece is following behind another piece. There is a fullbind and then a space of nothing as the chased piece moves forward and then another fullbind as the chaser moves forward without a prebind in between.
Do I have an incorrect definition of fullbind?
I thought it just meant pieces touching each other and prebinds were pieces at corners to each other.


I have quit the site until the cheating players are dealt with.


#10 HmmNess

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 01:24 AM

What about when a piece is following behind another piece. There is a fullbind and then a space of nothing as the chased piece moves forward and then another fullbind as the chaser moves forward without a prebind in between.
Do I have an incorrect definition of fullbind?
I thought it just meant pieces touching each other and prebinds were pieces at corners to each other.

 

A Full-bind can ONLY be created if a pre-bind was created first.  The situation you laid out with a space between 2 pieces and the pieces join together.... this would NOT create a full-bind since a pre-bind was not created first.  You can chase someone across the board this way since no pre-binds were created, and in my opinion, you should be able to chase someone down in this manner.

 

You are right, if the pieces are touching each other horizontally or vertically, this would create a full-bind, BUT only if a pre-bind was created 1st.

 

Basically look at it this way:  You have to be diagonally touching an enemy piece to create a pre-bind.  Once you are diagonally touching a piece, you can create a full-bind by moving your piece in a manner that is touching an enemy piece horizontally or vertically.  The pre-bind needs to be set before the full-bind can ever be in effect.

 

HmmNess


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#11 varishnakov

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 01:29 AM

2v3hchj.gif

Okay so, when they are touching it is just a 'bind' or it is a 'nothing?'
It is not anything unless it is preceded by a full bind.

Okay, that just blew my mind.

Then maybe we're not so different after all.

 


I have quit the site until the cheating players are dealt with.


#12 HmmNess

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 01:34 AM

yup, your picture is correct.  The bottom half of the game board is not a full-bind.  The top part is how you create a prebind which may turn into a full-bind.

 

If the miner on the bottom half of the board moved down or up a space, the minor would create a pre-bind.  Now the col has be careful, because he will create a full bind if he attempts to keep chasing.

 

The binding system will allow traps.  Most of the game is about restricting pieces from moving, not always capturing right away.

 

HmmNess


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#13 Angelus

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Posted 31 May 2013 - 08:51 AM

I've talked to MD and we're ready to change to 10 full binds. Let us find a nice downtime moment and it'll be fixed.


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#14 HmmNess

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Posted 31 May 2013 - 10:30 AM

Sounds great Angelus, thx for the response.

 

HmmNess


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#15 Luckypapa

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Posted 31 May 2013 - 06:04 PM

HmmNess, If I understand correctly, you have already 10 fullbinds when you attack a piece in the first left corner of the board and chase this piece upto the second left corner. Don't you think 10 fullbinds is a little to less?

I agree, chasing mustn't be endless, but 10 moves doesn't feel good.

I vote 15, but that is  to late to have influence I think, looking to the answer of Angelus.

Nevertheless, It will be better then what we have now. Many times my piece could not move at all to soon,

 

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#16 HmmNess

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Posted 31 May 2013 - 11:40 PM

Chasing for 10 moves up or down the board should be enough to get yourself into position without being warned.  15 Might be a little too much in my opinion.  I would go for 15 or even 20 if we had a card warning system.  It would basically work like so...

 

1.)  You create 15 full-binds and you get a message warning only.

2.)  You chase again and create 15 full-binds which will give you another message warning.

3.)  You chase again and create 15 full-binds which will give you a Green Card.

4.)  You chase again and create 15 full-binds which will give you a Yellow Card.

5.)  You chase again and create 15 full-binds which will give you a Red Card.

6.)  Once you have recieved a Red Card, you automatically forfiet the match.

 

I think this would be nice.  It would cause players to check themselves which also giving players the room to experiment with different positions which chasing.  New players would catch on eventually.

 

HmmNess


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#17 GaryLShelton

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 07:46 AM

What about when a piece is following behind another piece. There is a fullbind and then a space of nothing as the chased piece moves forward and then another fullbind as the chaser moves forward without a prebind in between.
Do I have an incorrect definition of fullbind?
I thought it just meant pieces touching each other and prebinds were pieces at corners to each other.



A Full-bind can ONLY be created if a pre-bind was created first. The situation you laid out with a space between 2 pieces and the pieces join together.... this would NOT create a full-bind since a pre-bind was not created first. You can chase someone across the board this way since no pre-binds were created, and in my opinion, you should be able to chase someone down in this manner.

You are right, if the pieces are touching each other horizontally or vertically, this would create a full-bind, BUT only if a pre-bind was created 1st.

Basically look at it this way: You have to be diagonally touching an enemy piece to create a pre-bind. Once you are diagonally touching a piece, you can create a full-bind by moving your piece in a manner that is touching an enemy piece horizontally or vertically. The pre-bind needs to be set before the full-bind can ever be in effect.

HmmNess


HmmNess, the following is offered in the spirit of constructive dialogue.

I disagree, of course, with the statement that a full-bind can ONLY be created if a pre-bind was created first. A full-bind is simply when two pieces are touching each other either vertically or horizontally, just as Varishnakov believed. What is true is that there are two kinds of chasing: the pre-bind/full-bind type, and the full-bind/full-bind type. Your requirement of the pre-bind ahead of the first full-bind does do the trick against the kind of chasing that keeps a chased piece moving back and forth only in a straight line, and against an outside border where one cannot turn or move past the chaser. I agree here. But in Varishnakov's example the Colonel is chasing a Sergeant and the Sergeant is not against the wall or border; he is on the inside, and the Sergeant can turn once past the pond. Once he turns, the chase becomes a full-bind/full-bind affair along the straightaway.

The fact is, full-bind/full-bind chasing exists. And, if it is not addressed in the proposed anti-chasing rule, it will leave open a sore spot for chasers to still exploit.

I understand, yes, that you think this kind of chasing should be allowed, that it is "legal" chasing, and that good players don't want to drive an enemy piece into their camp anyway, that it is not generally wise. But the facts that the chased piece can participate more in the direction of the chase in this situation, and that the chase will at some point bring an opponent into one's turf, in no way make this type of chase less never-ending if employed by a determined chaser. Consider, first, that even in your pre-bind/full-bind chase the chased piece can lead the action if the pre-bind comes from the outside, just as in Varishnakov's example, so that in this case the pre-bind/full-bind gives just as much leeway to the chased piece as a full-bind/full-bind chase does. Consider, second, that even if the chased piece is driven into his opponent's camp, there may not be much in the late game stage to wipe out, assuming the chased piece is superior in rank to any of his opponent's pieces.

If someone chases you, HmmNess--doing "illegal" chasing--for an hour and twenty minutes, as you mentioned in your previous stint in the forums, don't you think that that person could've easily chased you for the same hour and twenty minutes in a full-bind/full-bind chase if that option were the only one still allowed to them? Don't you think this is so?

I agree that the chased person can direct the full-bind/full-bind chase and change it back into a pre-bind/full-bind. But if he does this, we are forcing the chased piece to seek the shelter of the pre-bind/full-bind rule for protection, and then the chase will get stopped by the current rule at 5 moves. But this merely means only a one-turn break and then the chasing can resume again. There is currently no total game limit on such activity. So no matter how we go with this anti-chasing rule, this total game limit issue is going to be like the elephant in the living room...very hard to ignore.

In view of what we currently have on the site, and what is likely to get acted upon, my suggestions seem radical. But in the full interest of beta testing, here goes. I would dump the entire notion of the pre-bind and just count full-binds only. And then make the limit high, make it 20 (or even higher). At 20 full-binds--no matter if they were preceded by a pre-bind or not--a chase can go completely one time around both ponds, or back and forth one time across the entire board in a straight line. By eliminating the pre-bind concept we make things simpler; and both kinds of chasing are counted. By making the number high we take our proposal out of the "intrusive rule" camp and move it into the "sensible" camp.

For those who would object to a senseless pre-bind/full-bind chase being allowed to go on well past the obviousness of it, I say, put in a total game limit of 180-200 moves for the chasing at the cost of an automatic loss if breached. If a chaser violates civility 20 times in one chase, hey, he can only do that 9-10 times and he loses. There's no sense in stopping him at 5 or even 10 moves, having the chase rule kick in, then waiting a turn for the chase to resume. Just let the chases all go 20 moves and save everyone the hassle of the chasing warning. This thought is akin to taking out half the toll booths on the toll road and just charging twice as much at the ones that are left. It would be so much less stressful.

This total game limit on chasing would be in harmony with the proposed 200 moves-per-player Auto Draw rule. One could not chase his way to a Draw under this scheme.

 

 [The following edited by GLS]

HmmNess, I kind of like your Warning Card system, but I would still make the Red Card level nearer to the 180-200 moves I suggest above.  I would adjust the Forfeiture point to about 10 moves past receiving the Red Warning Card, otherwise there's no real point in having the final Red Card at all.  Game's already over.  So, give a few moves after issuing the Red Card and let the person know how thin the ice is for him at this point.  GLS


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#18 HmmNess

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Posted 03 June 2013 - 07:17 AM

I disagree, of course, with the statement that a full-bind can ONLY be created if a pre-bind was created first. A full-bind is simply when two pieces are touching each other either vertically or horizontally, just as Varishnakov believed. What is true is that there are two kinds of chasing: the pre-bind/full-bind type, and the full-bind/full-bind type. Your requirement of the pre-bind ahead of the first full-bind does do the trick against the kind of chasing that keeps a chased piece moving back and forth only in a straight line, and against an outside border where one cannot turn or move past the chaser. I agree here. But in Varishnakov's example the Colonel is chasing a Sergeant and the Sergeant is not against the wall or border; he is on the inside, and the Sergeant can turn once past the pond. Once he turns, the chase becomes a full-bind/full-bind affair along the straightaway.

The fact is, full-bind/full-bind chasing exists. And, if it is not addressed in the proposed anti-chasing rule, it will leave open a sore spot for chasers to still exploit.

I understand, yes, that you think this kind of chasing should be allowed, that it is "legal" chasing, and that good players don't want to drive an enemy piece into their camp anyway, that it is not generally wise. But the facts that the chased piece can participate more in the direction of the chase in this situation, and that the chase will at some point bring an opponent into one's turf, in no way make this type of chase less never-ending if employed by a determined chaser. Consider, first, that even in your pre-bind/full-bind chase the chased piece can lead the action if the pre-bind comes from the outside, just as in Varishnakov's example, so that in this case the pre-bind/full-bind gives just as much leeway to the chased piece as a full-bind/full-bind chase does. Consider, second, that even if the chased piece is driven into his opponent's camp, there may not be much in the late game stage to wipe out, assuming the chased piece is superior in rank to any of his opponent's pieces.

If someone chases you, HmmNess--doing "illegal" chasing--for an hour and twenty minutes, as you mentioned in your previous stint in the forums, don't you think that that person could've easily chased you for the same hour and twenty minutes in a full-bind/full-bind chase if that option were the only one still allowed to them? Don't you think this is so?

I agree that the chased person can direct the full-bind/full-bind chase and change it back into a pre-bind/full-bind. But if he does this, we are forcing the chased piece to seek the shelter of the pre-bind/full-bind rule for protection, and then the chase will get stopped by the current rule at 5 moves. But this merely means only a one-turn break and then the chasing can resume again. There is currently no total game limit on such activity. So no matter how we go with this anti-chasing rule, this total game limit issue is going to be like the elephant in the living room...very hard to ignore.

In view of what we currently have on the site, and what is likely to get acted upon, my suggestions seem radical. But in the full interest of beta testing, here goes. I would dump the entire notion of the pre-bind and just count full-binds only. And then make the limit high, make it 20 (or even higher). At 20 full-binds--no matter if they were preceded by a pre-bind or not--a chase can go completely one time around both ponds, or back and forth one time across the entire board in a straight line. By eliminating the pre-bind concept we make things simpler; and both kinds of chasing are counted. By making the number high we take our proposal out of the "intrusive rule" camp and move it into the "sensible" camp.

 

I understand what you are saying, but there is a reason why I instituted the pre-bind / full-bind system.  Without pre-binds you will have players getting warned for not really chasing much at all.  The system you want is my old Full-bind only system, so let's look at the problem with my old system with only Full-binds.

 

Because of the 2 square rule, players can move back and forth to dodge an attack in the same 2 squares for a total of 3 moves before being warned that they can not move back and forth between the same 2 spaces.  To chase someone to their base from 1 side of the board to the other side of the board while using the 2 square rule will take 35 moves for the attacking player.  That means that 20 full-binds will cut the chase short, and someone trapping a player because of the 2 square rule will be dinged for chasing before 35 full-binds.  This will allow the defending player to move away from position and avoid the trap.  This could even give the defending player an advantage to counter attack with the defending piece if the attacking piece is stuck, because of chasing endlessly.

 

There are 2 ways to fix this problem.

1.)  Allow 35 Full-binds before a warning message.

2.)  Have a pre-bind system that will work with the full-bind system.

 

35 full-binds may take a while, but might be the right system to implement, since some players will not know they are chasing.  But, if 35 full-binds are allowed before a warning and we take out the pre-bind system all together, we had better put the warning card system in place that will force people to forfeit if they are warned too many times.  I agree, this system would stop endless chasing and the endless run around the ponds.

 

I thought the pre-bind system would be a better move, since it would stop the endless loop chase and would ding people immediately after 5 full-binds.  This would let people know right away that they can not chase.  The problem with this system is that is does not stop the endless pond chasing that people are complaining about.  If we want to stop both types of chasing, we should probably incorporate my old system with 35 full-binds.

 

For those who would object to a senseless pre-bind/full-bind chase being allowed to go on well past the obviousness of it, I say, put in a total game limit of 180-200 moves for the chasing at the cost of an automatic loss if breached. If a chaser violates civility 20 times in one chase, hey, he can only do that 9-10 times and he loses. There's no sense in stopping him at 5 or even 10 moves, having the chase rule kick in, then waiting a turn for the chase to resume. Just let the chases all go 20 moves and save everyone the hassle of the chasing warning. This thought is akin to taking out half the toll booths on the toll road and just charging twice as much at the ones that are left. It would be so much less stressful.

This total game limit on chasing would be in harmony with the proposed 200 moves-per-player Auto Draw rule. One could not chase his way to a Draw under this scheme.

 

 [The following edited by GLS]

HmmNess, I kind of like your Warning Card system, but I would still make the Red Card level nearer to the 180-200 moves I suggest above.  I would adjust the Forfeiture point to about 10 moves past receiving the Red Warning Card, otherwise there's no real point in having the final Red Card at all.  Game's already over.  So, give a few moves after issuing the Red Card and let the person know how thin the ice is for him at this point.  GLS

 

The Card system would take care of this and warn people throughout the game to let them know that they are in danger of forfeiting, because of chasing.  A yellow card tells the player that they are on thin ice.  No one wants to see a Red Card, so showing the Red Card before a player is forced to forfeit the match, imo is right on the money.  The Red Card is not needed, but it is nice to give players that final slap in the face while saying "Don't do that again next time you play.  Here is you loss"

 

I don't believe we should ding players for each chase "move."  There are times where you need to chase a little to get into someone's head or maybe see if they will make a mistake.  You don't want to ding a player near the end of the game just because they hit 200 chase moves during the game.  Most players will wonder why they have the loss.

 

So....

 

All in all, I think you have helped me to realize that the pond chasing and endless loop chasing can be fixed with full-binds only as long as we have around 30-35 full-binds before a player is warned.  You are right, this is a simpler way of dealing with chasers.  If we add the card system to this, we have around 175 full-binds that can be made in 1 swoop.  This would force a loss and would not affect the automatic 200 move per player draw system.

 

What are your thoughts?

 

HmmNess


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#19 GaryLShelton

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Posted 04 June 2013 - 06:53 AM

I understand what you are saying, but there is a reason why I instituted the pre-bind / full-bind system.  Without pre-binds you will have players getting warned for not really chasing much at all.  The system you want is my old Full-bind only system, so let's look at the problem with my old system with only Full-binds.

 

Because of the 2 square rule, players can move back and forth to dodge an attack in the same 2 squares for a total of 3 moves before being warned that they can not move back and forth between the same 2 spaces.  To chase someone to their base from 1 side of the board to the other side of the board while using the 2 square rule will take 35 moves for the attacking player.  That means that 20 full-binds will cut the chase short, and someone trapping a player because of the 2 square rule will be dinged for chasing before 35 full-binds.  This will allow the defending player to move away from position and avoid the trap.  This could even give the defending player an advantage to counter attack with the defending piece if the attacking piece is stuck, because of chasing endlessly.

 

HmmNess,  thank you for your thoughtful response.  

 

Well, I never thought I'd say this, but "God Bless the 2-Square Rule"!

 

That's tongue-in-cheek, naturally.  I like the higher count on full-binds but I dislike the reason you give for coming up with this alternative.  That is, of course, you are stating that we need 30-35 full-binds to work with the 2-square rule.  As a guy who once, long ago, proposed 50 moves in this forum, I think the 30-35 number is very un-intrusive, and therefore a good alternative.  So if it takes the 2-Square Rule to get it to come about, then hallelujah!  Your plan to combine the Anti-Chase Rule and the 2-Square Rule is shrewd.  But I still don't believe in the 2-Square Rule, nor the notion that this rule is good when it acts like the proverbial "third hand" to help an attacker in a kill that would otherwise take a strategic working in of a 2nd backup piece to do the job.  That is the way the board game would be played.  Your objection to the defender being unintentionally given the advantage to counter attack brings to my mind the old adages, "He who lives by the sword, dies by the sword."  And, "Never play with fire." In simple terms I don't like the 2-Square Rule because it gives an advantage for a knowledgeable attacker that does not exist in the board game.  In the board game the chased piece can NEVER be killed by any single piece.

 

Eventually, I would hope that we could establish a solid anti-chasing rule and then eliminate the 2-Square Rule from this site.  The latter is not necessary for a good Anti-Chasing Rule to exist.

 

Moving on...

 

There are 2 ways to fix this problem.

1.)  Allow 35 Full-binds before a warning message.

2.)  Have a pre-bind system that will work with the full-bind system.

 

35 full-binds may take a while, but might be the right system to implement, since some players will not know they are chasing.  But, if 35 full-binds are allowed before a warning and we take out the pre-bind system all together, we had better put the warning card system in place that will force people to forfeit if they are warned too many times.  I agree, this system would stop endless chasing and the endless run around the ponds.

 

I thought the pre-bind system would be a better move, since it would stop the endless loop chase and would ding people immediately after 5 full-binds.  This would let people know right away that they can not chase.  The problem with this system is that is does not stop the endless pond chasing that people are complaining about.  If we want to stop both types of chasing, we should probably incorporate my old system with 35 full-binds.

 

The Card system would take care of this and warn people throughout the game to let them know that they are in danger of forfeiting, because of chasing.  A yellow card tells the player that they are on thin ice.  No one wants to see a Red Card, so showing the Red Card before a player is forced to forfeit the match, imo is right on the money.  The Red Card is not needed, but it is nice to give players that final slap in the face while saying "Don't do that again next time you play.  Here is you loss"

 

I don't believe we should ding players for each chase "move."  There are times where you need to chase a little to get into someone's head or maybe see if they will make a mistake.  You don't want to ding a player near the end of the game just because they hit 200 chase moves during the game.  Most players will wonder why they have the loss.

 

So....

 

All in all, I think you have helped me to realize that the pond chasing and endless loop chasing can be fixed with full-binds only as long as we have around 30-35 full-binds before a player is warned.  You are right, this is a simpler way of dealing with chasers.  If we add the card system to this, we have around 175 full-binds that can be made in 1 swoop.  This would force a loss and would not affect the automatic 200 move per player draw system.

 

What are your thoughts?

 

HmmNess

 

I really don't think we're all that far apart here.  I like the 30-35 move notion.  I like the Warning Card System, and I am almost for it, though I still say that a total game limit on chasing moves makes a lot of sense.  But more on this in the "Some Notes" below.  

 

It is good to have the Warning Card limit at 180 (175 + 5 = 180) total full-bind moves since that is lower than the 200 Auto Draw figure.  I would only still contend that in the forfeiture of the game there should be 5 moves after the Red Card.    After all, if one "Red Lines" a car, the car doesn't automatically blow up....but one is very close perhaps....  I don't know how many people would see your Red Card, HmmNess, if it didn't come until you suggest, as so many players are "outta here!" as soon as the banners flash up.  A Red Light is generally a strong warning.  But it doesn't mean death.  Black is death.  To plagiarize Billy Crystal from "A Princess Bride", "Red is only mostly dead!"  So let's give 'em the Red Card when they're only "mostly" dead. 

 

With my one suggested change, I would assume that the Warning Card levels could be recalibrated to:

 

      1.)  You create 35 full-binds and you get a message warning only.

      2.)  You chase again and create 35 full-binds which will give you another message warning.

      3.)  You chase again and create 35 full-binds which will give you a Green Card.

      4.)  You chase again and create 35 full-binds which will give you a Yellow Card.

      5.)  You chase again and create 35 full-binds which will give you a Red Card.  Special 5 move countdown timer appears.

      6.)  Automatic Loss strikes offending player after 5 full-bind chasing moves beyond the Red Card.

 

This would total 180 chasing moves in the game, but broken down into 5 separate chasing events.

 

Some notes.  I would suggest that the Warning Cards and the Special 5 move countdown timer be visible to both players.  This would aid in screen shots to show that the offending player was at a certain level of warning in disputes.  Second, I believe there should be included in the Rule an exception for "incidental" chasing.  This "incidental" chasing would be the first full bind between any two pieces, and would be ignored by the computer.  This would correct one thing and insure against another:  

  1. Officially, on this site anyway, the situation Trickz and Nortrom discussed with the Marshal and General losing to the pair of Miners under the ISF rules would be fixed so that such a travesty could not occur.  
  2. The mere passing of one piece in front of a line of his unknown opponents would not result in a full-bind being counted by the computer for each full-bind made in that process.  For a player under the Red Card, this could be a huge factor.

One thing I believe still stands out as a problem with the Warning Card System is that a player can, under the proposal herein, chase for 34 times, break off, and then resume again after only one turn moving another piece.   He wouldn't even get a warning card or even an initial warning if it was the first time.  But, if you incorporate a total game chasing limit into the Anti-Chasing Rule, then you address this distinct possibility.  It would be the "net" to catch the ones would game the 35 move limit.  But it must be noted, though, that it would be possible under this idea to invoke the automatic forfeiture and not have a single Warning Card issued.  So do we really need the Warning Cards?  

 

We need a total game limit, I think, and also a per-incident limit.  One possible suggestion here is that I could see the Warning Card levels be made to represent specific levels of chasing within the whole game, and not merely tied to an individual chasing episode.  That is, I would propose the following changes to the Warning Card System:

 

      1.)  You create   35 full-binds within the game and you get a message warning only.

      2.)  You create   70 full-binds within the game and you get another message warning.

      3.)  You create 105 full-binds within the game and you get a Green Card.

      4.)  You create 140 full-binds within the game and you get a Yellow Card.

      5.)  You create 175 full-binds within the game and you get a Red Card.  Special 5 move countdown timer appears.

      6.)  Automatic Loss strikes offending player after 5 full-bind chasing moves beyond the Red Card

 

Finally, I would suggest we discuss how the chase is to be counted as "broken off".  If it is only one turn, then there can be a lot of resumed chases after a mere one-turn break.  Would it be a good idea to invoke a 2 turn break penalty after each Warning Card level was reached?  My total game limit would catch the guilty chaser whether he took a one-turn break, or two, or ten.  

 

There are probably other issues I cannot think to address tonight, but I'm zapped.  Hope this is helpful.  GLS


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#20 HmmNess

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Posted 07 June 2013 - 09:43 AM

The 2 square rule will stay in game, I know that for sure.  The 2 square rule is really needed for players that are trying to run away all day.  It slows down game play in my opinion.

 

Im not too worried about the Red Card being your last warning.  In soccer, a Red card means you are gone.  So, having a red card in here while booting you out and giving you a loss sounds good to me.

 

The problem with a chase limit is that it might catch good players that are not really chasing in a cheating sort of way to waste time.  I chase players down a little sometimes just to mess with them, but I will stop before i get dinged for it.  Sometimes you want to get a certain position so you need to chase a bit to corner or trap your opponent.  Players can constantly dodge your attacks to force you to forfeit from your idea.

 

Will the 2 square rule in place, backing someone down is going to give you a bunch of "Chase" points that might ruin the game for you.

 

HmmNess


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