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Was I right to accept draw?


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#1 roeczak

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Posted 27 August 2016 - 09:13 PM

This was CL game roeczak (480) vs Great Manos (680)
In the end position was like this (my back 4 rows:
                                  7 (5th row)
-   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   6
-   -   -   0  -   -   -   -   B   -
-   -   -   -  B   -   -   4   -  B

-  -    5  B  F  B  3   5  3  

 

 

I (Red) have my Marshal (0) which is known, my Captain (which is known , but blocked by his major) 2 Lieutenants, a sergeant and two miners (unknown and unmoved). He (Blue) has his major , 1 Lieutenant, 2 sergeants, three miners, a scout and the spy. He offered me a draw and I kept pondering until the 30 seconds elapsed, but then I decided I was happy with the draw and offered him a draw, which he accepted.

My reasoning was that I have lost similar positions with my side and won with the other side , I have less miners, and i am not able to activate my pieces without revealing my flag location. And even if i manage to trade everything i will still probably be unable to capture his scout so in best case it is a draw .

My Question is this (to more experienced , 500+ players): Who do you think is in better position and what would your winning plan be with the side that you believe has an advantage? Was i right to accept draw?

Thanks in advance,

roeczak

 


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#2 --Wogomite--

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Posted 28 August 2016 - 01:29 AM

The two square rule wins you the game. Pull everything out, at this point it does not matter if he knows the flag. You have marsh capt 2 leuits 1 serg 2 miners vs. his major 1 leuit, 2 sergs, 3 miners your flag is protected by filling your lanes to prevent a miner from getting through and while avoiding his major all at the same time. You can do this and trade few pieces for the time being until you can get your capt free by sending your marsh leuit up the middle and around to the right to allow your capt free. Once your capt is free you have two pieces to pinch every other piece on the board and all because you already know his major. At this point you play the patient game be simply clogging all three lanes and picking off his pieces one at a time before he can trade you down to a point of your demise. 

To free your capt you would want to open a path to run a direct route left to the middle and up with the marsh while ensuring not to endanger any piece in the process. In reality you only have to protect one lane which is the furthest one to the left. You can easily do that with your leuit because you have another sergent to follow behind. So trading one leut and a serg on left (worst case scenario) puts you at marsh, capt, leuit, 2 miners vs. major serg 3 miners. Now you have three pieces to pick off his with and you can finally take his spy if you have not already. His major is null and void at this point. He might as well not even have it. He will never take another piece with it. You had an uphill battle working for you!



#3 scottrussia

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Posted 28 August 2016 - 03:16 AM

Who cares what your opponents ELO is?

 

Fight to the end!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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#4 roeczak

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Posted 28 August 2016 - 08:12 AM

What about his scout?

Also , how can I pull out my remaining pieces with his major where he is now? Bring the Marshal?

Thanks anyway , great plan. That is what I need to learn to progress past 500.

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#5 Napoleon 1er

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Posted 28 August 2016 - 10:29 AM

if you have never moved your sergeant and miner on the right I don't know how you could have 2 empty spaces behind the bombs on the right? Ar you sure you never moved those pieces?

Never mind I think it was a little bit early to accept the draw and you still have some chances to win. Obviously because of 2 square rule he could not move only his major he must have had (at least) one other piece moving. You should have been attacking this other piece with your 2 lieut. If this other piece was the scout you should have been able to trap it with the 2 lieut, your marsh and possibly one other piece. At a certain point he had to move his lieut to protect the scout. and you can exchange lieuts. Then you place your sergeant to guard left lane and you move your marsh in the center lane until you get in diagonal of one of his unmoved piece and in such a way that he cannot pass a piece in your field through the center lane. Your lieut shall then go attacking the moved piece or pieces (if there is only one try to block it in diagonal of your lieut to force him move another piece). Don't be to much afraid of the spy cause if he wants to threaten your marsh with a 50/50 he has to put in motion minimum 2 pieces which is precisely what you want him to do. This would reveal his setup and you know where to attack with your lieut keeping your sergeant in the left line. If your lieut and your marsh are not sufficient to capture these 2 other moving pieces without opening the center lane then make sure these 2 pieces  are blocked on the right side in such way that he can neither bring them to field through right lane (your cap is blocking the path there) nor through center or right lane (your lieut and marsh will block them on the right). Then you can pass one of your miner either from center or from left lane and go scouting unmoved pieces of his last row where you believe the flag could be. For your info and without knowing where he has most aggregation of unmoved pieces my guess is that his flag is somewhere on right side because he is keeping his major there disabling you the access to his field from the right. When you bring in your miner on the left he may start to move a new unmoved piece. This may well be a seargant or a miner. At this point if your miner has not been able to reach last row bring him back in center close to your marsh and with marsh and lieut try to trap this newly moved piece or try to force him aligning it on his 2nd row with one of the moved pieces which are blocked on the right in such a way that it creates a favorable 2 square rule situation for your lieut who would then be able to capture one of the 3 moved pieces. this information will then increase your advantage and you can reattack his last row with your miner. If everything would really go bad for you and your miner get lost on a sergeant or your sergeant get exchanged on the left then you can still block the 3 lanes and accept the draw.

I guess in this situation you shall be able to get victory if you play it well.


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#6 Moghedien

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Posted 28 August 2016 - 11:46 AM

Basically all is said by Wogomite and Napoleon. They present the case well I think. I would also not have accepteer a draw at this point. Interesting question by Napoleon by the way, you must have moved the serg and/or miner on your right to allow those spaces behind the bombs to become free.

#7 roeczak

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Posted 28 August 2016 - 01:06 PM

Um... oops my bad move the whole 4, 3, 5, 3 cluster one square to the right

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#8 roeczak

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Posted 28 August 2016 - 01:13 PM

Thanks Napoleon sounds like I really should have played on. One last problem : how do I move the other pieces withouth the risk of him lottoing with his major and taking my pieces? I must move my Marshal right?

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#9 Napoleon 1er

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Posted 28 August 2016 - 01:32 PM

before you have exchanged his last lieut yes your marsh should be protecting your small pieces but when he has no more lieut, your cap is protected by being in diagonal of the major, your last lieut will be in his field, your sergeant will be on left, one of your miner close to your marsh and the last miner just make sure he remains always in diagonal of his major if he wants to attack with major.


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#10 roeczak

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Posted 28 August 2016 - 02:12 PM

Ok thanks a lot - it is positions like this I have tp study to progress past gold status.

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#11 GaryLShelton

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Posted 24 September 2016 - 05:07 PM

Good analysis by --wogomite-- and Napoleon 1er. Thanks for the question, roeczak.

I have to agree that I wouldn't have accepted the draw but one does have to study to make some of what has been said here innate and automatic to one. Keep playing! You'll progress because you ask good questions. :)
  • Kernel Mustard likes this
The complete GS&F Rules can be found here: http://forum.strateg...rum-rules-2016/

Draw Refusal Rules, specifically, can be read here: http://forum.strateg...604#entry339604




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