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Balanced or weak/ strong side set up


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#1 Bobby Dylan

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Posted 02 December 2019 - 04:17 PM

I was wondering what is better, al balanced set up with the marsh on one side and general on the other and the colonels on each sideof the board.

Or is it better to surprise the opponent with all the strong pieces together on one side?

It seems when I play silver or bronze and have to fear a marshall blitz attack, the balanced set up to try to spread the risk of a blitz is maybe better.

And when I player higher rated people, one strong side seem to surprise them sometimes.
But maybe I am wrong.

Anyway, I am interested in opinions about this!
If there already is a thread about this, please let me know.
I could not find it so far.
Thanks.


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#2 Sorrow

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Posted 02 December 2019 - 05:54 PM

Set up can only help you so much. Any fundamental correct set up is fine and even some with out perfect fundamentals for unpredictability is fine.

It just comes down to preference or your style.

Although it does seem you have it the opposite way from usual. It’s probably easier to beat someone who is playing on 1 or 2 lanes than all 3.
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#3 Lord Invader

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Posted 03 December 2019 - 12:33 AM

Good topic.  I'm far from the best player on this site, but I'd agree w/Sorrow.  You have to have a solid setup, but you also need to:

  • Read your opponent
  • Be able to "rebalance" your setup according to what you see your opponent doing.

For example, did you trade Colonels on the left?  Bring your other one over to the left, b/c chance are your opponent won't have both Colonels on the left, so you'll end up stronger than him on that side.

 

The other thing to do is add just one or two surprises to your setup, such as:

  • Colonel in the front row
  • Using an unmoved Captain or Major as a "fake bomb" to trap an opponent's Miner
  • Putting a Major, Colonel, or Marshal in the back row as a "fake Miner"

There are many other twists you can try...


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#4 MG_Earp

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Posted 03 December 2019 - 01:53 AM

I think this highly influencing your stile of play. You need to decide to play agressive or defensive.
Agressive:
If you want to make some traps,then to concentrate power on one side is ok. Even if you want to play blitzer, the same rules apply. Two colonels togehter or Marshal and General close together is always good points and you can get a lot of benefit from it. Bad thing is that most of the time the other side is protected with bombs, and after your opponent knows this you can be predictible.
Defensive:
I would prefer more balance setup when play defensive. Or if you are a good bluffer, then this metod is ok. But if your opponent knows that you like to play most of the time balance setup, you need to try and play unbalanced, he will be surprised.

In our group I always teach the begginers to play with balance setup, becouse they don't understand all tactics and strategies that are needed to play unbalance game. After time when people are familiar with the game, knows some tactics and traps, then it is time to use strategy like unbalance setup. Before they need to know fundaments of the game and understand the game itself. For begginera it is always good to use one or max two traps or bluffs in setup.
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#5 Bobby Dylan

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Posted 03 December 2019 - 03:54 PM

I like to play as an counter attacker. Wait till many pieces of my opponent have moved, try to discover the marshall, and then attack on the moved pieces with my general and a colonel and a miner behind the gen.

But most of the time, stronger players did not allow me to do that often, they are too smart for that.
For me I think a very agressive set up is difficult. I am too afraid to marshall blitz ( and I do not like to do that), and I play really bad if my marshall is known already in the beginning.

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#6 Lord Invader

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Posted 03 December 2019 - 05:42 PM

 I play really bad if my marshall is known already in the beginning.

 

Everyone plays badly once their Marshal gets revealed early.  It makes your opponent's General super strong.  When I started playing stratego online I was doing terribly, until I read this post by Dobby125 that really opened my eyes.  It should be required reading for new players.

 

What happens when your Marshal and General are revealed


Edited by Lord Invader, 03 December 2019 - 05:42 PM.

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#7 Bobby Dylan

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Posted 03 December 2019 - 05:58 PM

Really interesting post from Dobby125.
I did also watch all his video's on youtube.
This video's brought me from middle bronze to high silver/ low gold what I am now.

But sometimes I see very strong players who reveal marsh and gen very early. And because they are so good, they get away with it an win.
Wish I could learn that :)
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#8 Lord Invader

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Posted 03 December 2019 - 07:29 PM

Really interesting post from Dobby125.
I did also watch all his video's on youtube.
This video's brought me from middle bronze to high silver/ low gold what I am now.

But sometimes I see very strong players who reveal marsh and gen very early. And because they are so good, they get away with it an win.
Wish I could learn that :)

 

Once day I played a Platinum player (Greek) 5 times in a row and lost (badly) every time.  He was very aggressive with his Marshal and General.  He'd scout like crazy to find yours and then pin you down.  These types of players probably have Scouts and Sergeants up front and use the Marshal to pin you down while they gut you.  When you try to counterattack, they just scout your piece and eradicate it with the appropriate trap.  And every move this particular player made was perfect.  


Edited by Lord Invader, 03 December 2019 - 08:35 PM.

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#9 MG_Earp

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Posted 03 December 2019 - 07:31 PM

Really interesting post from Dobby125.
I did also watch all his video's on youtube.
This video's brought me from middle bronze to high silver/ low gold what I am now.

But sometimes I see very strong players who reveal marsh and gen very early. And because they are so good, they get away with it an win.
Wish I could learn that :)


You will learn to play same like they do. You just need to play and after every game analyse your game if you lose or win. You need to find your mistakes and work on them to improve them. Do some puzzles on this forum. There is forum topic aboit puzzles and is very useful. Read Lord Invader posts, he really good explain positions and tactics with editor :) True teacher. At the end you need to enjoy this game :)
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#10 Bobby Dylan

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Posted 03 December 2019 - 07:39 PM

True. Or such a player find my high pieces early and pinned them and I do not know what to do. Or he or she won so many of my low pieces and I am losing too.
That is also a problem with set ups. For example or my marshall is placed on an unexpected place and always too late for attacks. Or it is on 2nd row and too predictable.
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#11 Bobby Dylan

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Posted 03 December 2019 - 07:46 PM

Thanks MG_Earp for your advices!
I would like your post, but it seems I am out of likes for today.
Did you record your games?
I do not, but I write down my mistakes, and try to remember it.
And the stream of Nortrom in which he played a game against me was very instructive. I saw all the mistakes I made, hope to learn from it!
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#12 Tilor

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Posted 03 December 2019 - 11:10 PM

I am not the best player on the site (High Gold/Low Platinum), but I do have an opinion about balanced setups. I have played quite a few players who placed all their high ranking pieces on the same side. That is usually a giveaway about flag position. That doesn't mean I can beat a high platinum player because of this, but I won't beat them most of the time anyway. It also generally lets me know that the other side will be heavy with bombs. I am not a fan of unbalanced setups for those two reasons. 


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#13 MG_Earp

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Posted 04 December 2019 - 08:02 AM

I agree with Tilor. When you see unbalanced setup, you can be 90% sure that the flag is on side of his main power. This can be very dangerous and predictible like I wrote in the post before.
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#14 Dobby125

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Posted 07 December 2019 - 02:34 AM

A lot of times when players have all their high pieces(Marshal, General and Colonels) on 1 side, the flag is usually on that side and it's almost always an open flag.  And many times they don't have any bombs on that side. I always did a setup like that  when I played with the flag up front.  Many Marshal blitzers do that as well.  If you play an extreme overload setup, the key is to protect your bombs from being revealed by weak scouting pieces and to try to keep your high pieces hidden as long as possible.  If you can do both of those well, you have a good chance of surprising your opponent. 


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#15 Dobby125

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Posted 07 December 2019 - 02:45 AM

Once day I played a Platinum player (Greek) 5 times in a row and lost (badly) every time.  He was very aggressive with his Marshal and General.  He'd scout like crazy to find yours and then pin you down.  These types of players probably have Scouts and Sergeants up front and use the Marshal to pin you down while they gut you.  When you try to counterattack, they just scout your piece and eradicate it with the appropriate trap.  And every move this particular player made was perfect.  

 

There's another player that always revealed his Marshal down the center at the start, and his General on the right at the start, and his Colonel on the left at the start.  He tried to pin down all three lanes at the beginning of the game.  That shocked me the 1st time I saw that.  I think he got as high as Platinum Captain or Major.  I don't know if he's still always playing that way now.  It's certainly an interesting opening strategy.  


Edited by Dobby125, 07 December 2019 - 03:18 AM.

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#16 KnightofPepsi

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Posted 07 December 2019 - 03:28 AM

A lot of times when players have all their high pieces(Marshal, General and Colonels) on 1 side, the flag is usually on that side and it's almost always an open flag.  And many times they don't have any bombs on that side. I always did a setup like that  when I played with the flag up front.  Many Marshal blitzers do that as well.  If you play an extreme overload setup, the key is to protect your bombs from being revealed by weak scouting pieces and to try to keep your high pieces hidden as long as possible.  If you can do both of those well, you have a good chance of surprising your opponent. 

 

I agree that this is true for most bronze, silver and some gold players. Although another common setup is for them to bomb in a corner flag on their attack/heavy side.

 

High gold and platinum are harder to counter attack because they are more likely to stack a bomb or two on the heavy side just for deception. After all, on their weak side you're already scouting everything to make sure it's not a bomb.


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