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Public Discussion on Increased Penalties for DC


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#21 KissMyCookie

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Posted 26 January 2019 - 10:07 PM

How about a hodgepodge everyone's suggestions !

 

1) Warning note 

2) 12 pt deduction

3) 30 pt deduction

4) One week ban --- Don't really care for this option but would get players attention !

5) 100 pt deduction

6) MT discretion -- account reset or 100 pt deduction or a week ban plus 100 pt deduction--- all options open to MT at this point !

 

Astro's choice don't disconnect ! If ya do there is a cost --- My own feeling is 20 pt deduction. 

 

Too many options...this is just way TOO much work to add to the MT's case load...or didn't ya get the memo, RG???  ;)



#22 GaryLShelton

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 09:35 AM

Anyone who loses to a sneaky rejoiner should be reset to 100 as a warning against ineptitude.

.
This seems to bother you a great deal more than a disconnecter yet this is precisely what one has to worry about with every disconnect. Go off away from the screen for whatever reason during the disconnect 2:30 and you will find it happens a certain percentage of the time. So the disconnect which you say doesn't bother you in the least, tobermoryx, is the fertile breeding ground for sneaky rejoins.

What's the percentage of DC's that have an SR (sneaky rejoin)? I don't know for everyone else but about 10% for me.

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#23 tobermoryx

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 02:15 PM

Think you misread the quoted post there Gary.
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#24 Fairway

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 02:21 PM

Tobermoryx is saying that any player who loses as a result of a sneaky disconnect should be reset to 100 because of their lack of paying attention/caring.


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#25 rgillis783

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 02:45 PM

Too many options...this is just way TOO much work to add to the MT's case load...or didn't ya get the memo, RG???  ;)

Oh yes memo received and paced in my circular file but glad I was included---KMC. I think that is why I gave " my own feeling- 20 pt loss." This option has no escalators . I was wondering why Traxex has no chimed in ? From my reading they were for more penalties on disconnection.  :D  


Edited by rgillis783, 27 January 2019 - 02:45 PM.


#26 Don_Homer

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 05:20 PM

.
Don, actually, technically that's not always true. One type of ATW offense (buffer abuse) is recognized after 2 minutes of elapsed buffer with no change in the game, and typically at the end of the game. That's as opposed to a DC, which burns through 2:30 every time. Both of these offenses require two screens of evidence to establish to the MT and so are about the same on that end of things as well.

When you say you can go get a cup of tea during a disconnect, you're forgetting about the proverbial sneaky rejoiner. The only safe thing to do on a disconnect message box screen is to stay in your seat, attentive to the screen until the victory banner appears.

ok Gary but were talking about minor differences  in time then.

 

So youre right about the sneaky rejoiner, those crimes should be acted differently upon than simple disconnecters out of frustration or just a pc problem who knows. So the sneaky rejoiner should be punished significantly more severely than a simple disconnecter. 


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#27 GaryLShelton

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Posted 29 January 2019 - 11:21 AM

So youre right about the sneaky rejoiner, those crimes should be acted differently upon than simple disconnecters out of frustration or just a pc problem who knows. So the sneaky rejoiner should be punished significantly more severely than a simple disconnecter.

.
Currently:
DC gets a 50 point deduction
ATW gets a 50 point deduction plus one week off.
SR gets a 50 point deduction plus one week off.

Edited by GaryLShelton, 29 January 2019 - 07:11 PM.
Fixed error.


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The complete GS&F Rules can be found here: http://forum.strateg...rum-rules-2016/

Draw Refusal Rules, specifically, can be read here: http://forum.strateg...604#entry339604


#28 GaryLShelton

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Posted 29 January 2019 - 11:36 AM

Think you misread the quoted post there Gary.

.
Then I assume you agree that one cannot go AFK during a disconnect? For you can't go AFK and always avoid the SR. In which case I'm not sure why an unsportsmanlike waste of 2:30 of the game time doesn't bother you at all. You plainly have the thickest kind of skin.

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The complete GS&F Rules can be found here: http://forum.strateg...rum-rules-2016/

Draw Refusal Rules, specifically, can be read here: http://forum.strateg...604#entry339604


#29 GaryLShelton

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Posted 29 January 2019 - 11:44 AM

What about a new idea, guys? Leave the current regular 50 plan the same. Only place a reset level at some point to nab the worst of the recidivistics. I would say that four -50 penalties and then a reset for every time after that would be fine.

It would look like this:

-50
-50
-50
-50
Reset (every time thereafter)
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The complete GS&F Rules can be found here: http://forum.strateg...rum-rules-2016/

Draw Refusal Rules, specifically, can be read here: http://forum.strateg...604#entry339604


#30 KissMyCookie

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Posted 29 January 2019 - 11:46 AM

What about a new idea, guys? Leave the current regular 50 plan the same. Only place a reset level at some point to nab the worst of the recidivistics. I would say that four -50 penalties and then a reset for every time after that would be fine.

It would look like this:

-50
-50
-50
-50
Reset (every time thereafter)

 

If you feel that it does not create extra work for the MT, and that you folks can manage this without issue, I would support it. :)



#31 KissMyCookie

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Posted 29 January 2019 - 11:50 AM

Then I assume you agree that one cannot go AFK during a disconnect? For you can't go AFK and always avoid the SR. In which case I'm not sure why an unsportsmanlike waste of 2:30 of the game time doesn't bother you at all. You plainly have the thickest kind of skin.

 

Try to see a different view from the other side of the valley–I think tober is very practical here...if a player is in a winning position because his opponent has disconnected (intentionally or not), and the person sure to win leaves their computer for any number of reasons, if the opponent comes back and is able to trick the potential winner into a loss, the sneaky return deserves the win. Why? He used a sneaky strategy which ultimately worked. If a player is so silly as to throw away a solid lead because they want a sandwich, or a drink, or to check email, or to relieve an attack of flatulence, then in fact, they do deserve to lose for doing something utterly ridiculous.

 

If you're gonna play Stratego, play to win, not to eat a sandwich. :lol:


Edited by KissMyCookie, 29 January 2019 - 11:50 AM.

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#32 Nortrom

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Posted 29 January 2019 - 11:55 AM

If someone is willing to go that low, they just lack any form of decent sportmanship. Disconnecting out of spite is one thing. Throwing insults is an other.. but using the sneaky rejoin for +10 virtual points - no - this is a new all time low.

 

As for the DC thing - I'd rather up it to 100, which functions as a soft ELO reset over time. Makes things easier, too.

 

If that doesn't go, I think a reset (note there are two kind of resets.. an account reset and a reset to 100. We shouldn't be doing an account reset for this, I feel) to 100 after 5 x a point deduction (and then resetting the counter) can work too, just adds additional bookkeeping. 


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#33 KissMyCookie

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Posted 29 January 2019 - 12:22 PM

Well, the point is not that it is okay for a sneaky disconnect, and I do agree it is a low and pathetic strategy...my illustration is to point out that if you are going to play a match of Stratego, then there is no reason to leave your computer (barring serious emergencies–your family needs you, you hear a call for help, the house is on fire...truly serious and important stuff) until that match is over; and, if your opponent has disconnected, the match is still not over until the victory screen has shown itself and you have been rewarded your points...then go for your sandwich, or check email, or any number of other things. :)  To get up and walk away in such a situation which could allow your low-life opponent to achieve the lowest of the low level wins, ultimately becomes the fault of the person leaving the computer.

 

If a player can prove a sneaky return and get the offender busted, terrific...

 

...but that will only happen if the leading player stays at their computer until the bitter end!!!



#34 Don_Homer

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Posted 29 January 2019 - 06:41 PM

.
Currently:
DC gets a 50 point deduction.
ATW gets 100 point deduction plus one week off.
SR gets a 50 point deduction plus one week off.

Thanks, Gary. I dont think this makes much sense. DC I dont care much about (I disagree with Tober, I frequently get set up a cup of tea, checking my mails etc while waiting. Its good that ATW is penalised stronger. But in any case, SR should be penalised higher than DC in my opinion.


Edited by Don_Homer, 29 January 2019 - 06:43 PM.

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#35 Nortrom

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Posted 29 January 2019 - 06:59 PM

SR receives a higher penalty in that the player will be suspended for a week.


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#36 Don_Homer

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Posted 29 January 2019 - 07:03 PM

SR receives a higher penalty in that the player will be suspended for a week.

That gap is way too small dont you think?


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#37 Nortrom

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Posted 29 January 2019 - 07:05 PM

If a player deploys such a " tactic " the message will get across by suspending them for 7 days, hopefully. I don't think increasing the ELO adjustment to say -100 would make much difference.

 

If that is something you would advocate, I'd happily support it though.


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#38 GaryLShelton

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Posted 29 January 2019 - 07:15 PM

Thanks, Gary. I dont think this makes much sense.
...
Its good that ATW is penalised stronger. But in any case, SR should be penalised higher than DC in my opinion.

.
I made an error there, Don. Sorry. I wrote originally (and it's still copied that way in your quote of it) that ATW was a 100 point deduction plus a week off. It's only 50 points plus a week off. But the fact is that it's often done in conjunction with a DC case so that the person who does ATW usually, in fact, does get penalized 100 points plus a week off, as we add the penalties together.
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Draw Refusal Rules, specifically, can be read here: http://forum.strateg...604#entry339604


#39 tobermoryx

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Posted 30 January 2019 - 02:40 AM

A player who loses to a sneaky rejoin is like this goalkeeper


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#40 Nortrom

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Posted 01 February 2019 - 09:59 AM

If a player deploys such a " tactic " the message will get across by suspending them for 7 days, hopefully. I don't think increasing the ELO adjustment to say -100 would make much difference.

 

If that is something you would advocate, I'd happily support it though.

DH, what do you think?


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