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4th Online World Championships - Questions


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#21 Wogomite

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Posted 02 October 2018 - 07:22 PM

https://www.youtube....h?v=2hLxyVRIRPk it's still there.

Even so, allow him to take it down before disqualifying him because the rule was unclear for wco4.

#22 Master Mind

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Posted 02 October 2018 - 07:27 PM

https://www.youtube....h?v=2hLxyVRIRPk it's still there.


I'm sorry, I thought Sniper did remove it right away. Sorry for not properly checking that.

Anyways, I still agree with Wogomite

#23 ☆OVERLORD☆

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Posted 02 October 2018 - 07:38 PM

https://www.youtube....h?v=2hLxyVRIRPk it's still there.


Still there and its also ridiculous he didn't remove it as he claimed.

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#24 Napoleon 1er

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Posted 02 October 2018 - 08:03 PM

sorry if i miss something but what is it that prevents sniper from joining? ... what video or non video is the problem?


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#25 Napoleon 2ème

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Posted 02 October 2018 - 08:04 PM

I don't really understand what has happened, what is wrong with that video? Did he post it during the tourney and not as arranged?


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#26 Wogomite

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Posted 02 October 2018 - 11:43 PM

The video, Napo, is the link on the post prior to your post. The video is clearly some what disrespectful to have been posted without permission. The issue here is, the wco team is concerning themselves with it by disqualifying Sniper when the wco4 rules do not state that Sniper is in violation for what he did. Although wco3 may have been more intentional with the rules, wco4 is not and by Nortroms own attestation. The wco4 team is not taking their negligence of the rules as there own responsibility but instead disqualifying Sniper for something THEY LEFT OUT of the rules this year. Instead of allowing Sniper to abide to the left out rule,(which is something Sniper should not be obligated to do according to the published rules for wco4) they are simply claiming he should have known something impossible to know according to the wco4 rules. Snipers disqualification is unjust according to anything written by the wco team for this year yet they claim it is indeed just that he be disqualified.
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#27 astros

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Posted 02 October 2018 - 11:57 PM

The video, Napo, is the link on the post prior to your post. The video is clearly some what disrespectful to have been posted without permission. The issue here is, the wco team is concerning themselves with it by disqualifying Sniper when the wco4 rules do not state that Sniper is in violation for what he did. Although wco3 may have been more intentional with the rules, wco4 is not and by Nortroms own emission. The wco4 team is not taking there negligence to the rules as there own responsibility but instead disqualifying Sniper for something THEY LEFT OUT of the rules this year. Instead of allowing Sniper to abide to the left out rule, they are simply claiming he should have known something impossible to know according to the wco4 rules. Snipers disqualification is unjust according to anything written by the wco team for this year yet they claim it is indeed just that he be disqualified.

To clarify, while the WCO committee works as a group, I was the one who updated the rules and rewrote the section regarding publishing videos. Per rule 6.6, the WCO team has the right to not strictly adhere to the rules and it was our decision to reject - Sniper -'s entry. Regardless, if you want to get into semantics and even if only the WCO 4 rules are applied to - Sniper -, he is still guilty of violating rule 6.4 because he is sharing Overlord's setup without his permission.

 

To summarize: Nortom did not adapt that rule, per the rules, the WCO team is within its prerogative to reject Sniper's entry and even with the current wording, Sniper is still violating rule 6.4.


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#28 Wogomite

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 12:10 AM

I'm really not trying to argue for no reason, I'm simply trying to defend a player that according to the wco4 rules has not violated anything that he would have known would have disqualified him. According to rule 6.4 it specifically states "a WCO match that is shared publicly without permission..." as I stated earlier, the video in question is not a wco match which continues to point towards Snipers innocents. I understand that you claim authority to do what you want when you want according to rule 6.6 but without using your own rules to follows boundaries and standards, it keeps the participants walking on egg shells just wondering if they will cross a line unknown to them, makes your team look like dictators and quite honestly makes your rules semi unnecessary being that you can add to them when you please. It does not show stability. Again, I'm not trying to be a jerk, I'm just trying to defend someone's right via your own written rules. If you allowed him to take it down and he did not, I would understand. You are not even allowing him the chance to make it right by sticking him with an unwritten rule he could not have known.
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#29 Wogomite

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 12:17 AM

I just looked at rule 6.6 again and it states that the wco team will use rules outlined so that participants know what to expect. How would Sniper ever know to expect your verdict being that what he did to earn a disqualification is no where in the outlined rules. It seems the first part of 6.6 and the latter part of 6.6 do not compliment each other, they in fact contridict each othet.
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#30 astros

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 12:20 AM

Per rule 6.4:

"Please note that this rule still applies before and after the tournament ends and also applies to posting other's setups."

Sniper shared John's setup in the above video without his permission and he was asked by John to remove it. Therefore, he is in violation of the WCO 4 rules.

The WCO team had a discussion on the subject. Since I am a proponent of transparency on the forum, I will say that I personally voted to allow his entry. However, the WCO is run by a committee and I stand and support the group's decision to reject his application.

Furthermore, the WCO is not a democracy, it is a (benevolent) dictatorship. The committee is interpreting the rules to remove a player who has previously operated in bad faith, even if parts of the decision are not explicitly codified. This decision is final, if you are still concerned about it at the end of the tournament, then I encourage you to leave feedback in our survey so that we may improve in future years.
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#31 Wogomite

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 12:26 AM

Thank you for your kind response. I am disappointed with the decision but it is in fact yours to make as your team sees fit. I wish you all the best.

#32 Napoleon 1er

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 06:43 AM

What if new player - nipers - asks to join the WCO now? Assume minimum 250 and alias register ok.

Edited by Napoleon 1er, 03 October 2018 - 06:51 AM.

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#33 - Sniper -

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 07:57 AM

No need to escalate.
 
Was only hoping to join. Not expecting it due to being late.
 
As to why the video is still online. Never received a proper, friendly or polite request. Only dog-like public commands. Also never got an explanation as I did receive consent earlier. So were we to have had any decent private conversation or were there to be any sort of decent or polite request the video would have been long gone. For now did not put in the effort after being treated like a dog without a personal chance. No hard feelings left here though.
 
Thanks to all stepping up to their morals. That includes WCO organizers.
 
Albeit I disagree the decision is to be respected.

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#34 Napoleon 2ème

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 10:58 AM

I understand the WCO decision and point of view, as Astros said, it has been a group decision and not a single decision.

 

My question is: the non autorizated video should have been deleted and maybe that's not really nice from sniper. Point is, this is the past, it was an old tournament... Don't you accept him for a past mistake or because you think he could do this again?

 

Wouldn't it be a good compromise if you allow him to play with 1 defeat..?


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#35 Nortrom

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 11:19 AM

It's been up for several months despite request from the opponent (whether you like the language used or not doesn't nullify the fact there is a request) to have it not published.

 

Any late entry would enter with 1 defeat. The consequence of video publishing is clear.


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#36 Nortrom

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 11:26 AM

Exactly my point. This altering prevented sniper from properly understanding a knowledge that disqualified him from joining. In the court room, a judge and jury would favour sniper as he was improperly informed which means he was unable to know the standard In which would have qualified him. Being that this was not his fault for having a lack of knowledge, I don't see how it could be held against him. I see now you clearly don't want to see this fairly. It's apparent that your dislike for him will prevent a fair verdict on the case. My questions have been answered. Thank you for your....unbiased reply. :rolleyes:

 

It's a team decision, not an unanimous one, but still, a team decision. Your accusations are way off. Player ' jensneuij ' faces the same fate for publishing a vid w/o consent. 

 

Everyone has people they like or dislike; you'll not see me make different decisions based on that.

 

I hope that we can atleast agree on that recording video's without consent is somewhat questionable, but publishing without consent goes a step too far.


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#37 Napoleon 2ème

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 05:51 PM

It's a team decision, not an unanimous one, but still, a team decision. Your accusations are way off. Player ' jensneuij ' faces the same fate for publishing a vid w/o consent. 

 

Everyone has people they like or dislike; you'll not see me make different decisions based on that.

 

I hope that we can atleast agree on that recording video's without consent is somewhat questionable, but publishing without consent goes a step too far.

Wise words  ;)


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#38 Papaflesas 1821

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Posted 07 October 2018 - 01:46 PM

Pls be informed that I would like to participate, if it’s possible , at this tournament.
Ps. Back again after long time.
Thank you.

#39 Napoleon 1er

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Posted 07 October 2018 - 03:41 PM

I see that The Achaean has an alias called papaflessas, are you the same?
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#40 KARAISKAKIS

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Posted 07 October 2018 - 04:42 PM

I see that The Achaean has an alias called papaflessas, are you the same?


No relation at all



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