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Lonello Poll v2


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Poll: Should Lonello be demodded? (31 member(s) have cast votes)

Should Lonello be demodded and replaced with a new moderator?

  1. Yes (23 votes [74.19%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 74.19%

  2. No (8 votes [25.81%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 25.81%

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#21 Lonello

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Posted 29 March 2018 - 11:18 AM

Wasn't imperium banned for being an alias of a PB'd account ? I was under that impression.

Regarding the topic , i am still unsure what to vote. As Fairway said , removing a moderator is a very serious matter.

Lo, I know most of the issues raised here was after immense pressure by Nortrom/Morx, with their motives not easily understood by new players (like me) or non-European ones .

However , I think your behaviour has not really been exemplary and ypu should definitely improve your reactions.

There are 3 options:

1) Do nothing about it: In this case you ignore a portion of the community (how big it is is debatable, but it is a considerable portion) which I do not recommend
2) Resign from MT: This one is self explanatory. However it is not so simple, as a suitable replacement must be found. If I understand correctly also he must be Dutch. Right now I can not think of someone who would be suitable to replace Lo. I would vote for Master Mind , but i do not know if he wants, if he he has the time and he is also a TC member .
3) Remain on MT, send all the "cases" to admin to decide about the situation and promise that if you are found guilty of non exemplary behaviour again , you will step down (In the meantime prepare a new Mt member).

I do not know the situation with the Dutch clubs however so maybe I am not the most relevant ones to voice his opinion.

I'd like to hear from Dutch players, however most of them hide their account/don't care it seems.

 

Roeczak, you're right on imperium, and it was all confirmed by Admin too, so we leave this as it is. Mind also that in all these years never one action of mine was taken back by MT. Not a single time. Never. That's because I am too dovish I guess, but you have to encounter everything in life so I do hope it'll come to one in my days ;). And in MT we luckily do have some hawks too so we're a good balanced Team. The Dutch however tend to allow a lot more than for instance Greeks and Americans.

As for your other point, that is exactly what I said in the thread where Nortrom's friends came with dictatorships and doctrines. Your way, the qualifiers, is simply the superb way to go but Nortrom simply took the opportunity to do it his way, by ranks, and I was surprised at his initiative as well but nobody objected and there was nothing to complain about either because just check the Dutch records:

Many tournaments happening on the Greek subforum. Many happening on the NASF subforum. Then some happening on Juniors... but none happening on the Dutch subforum. Zero. There simply has never ever been one. Not once. MT can (and did) try to animate and help out where we can but that's all we can do. If there is just no activity then that is it and if Nortrom hadn't set these lines, there probably wouldn't even have been a Dutch team in the first place. His method is the easy way out though so if it would ever come to qualifiers that would be great. Could actually be the very first tournament on the Dutch subboard :)!!

Anyway, as said earlier we have your Option 3 in the works. Admin is constantly reviewing this... the trained warmongerers, and how we act. It's an open case so when needed they'll intervene. I for one feel the obligation to warn the community what is and has been happening and I have also been right, just judging these last 4 months of warfare coming from 1 side, against now just the 4th target. This kind of harassment is abnormal to any forum but will happen if you're too dovish and you deal with the most hardened witch hunters.. just check their PB/WP-status for apolling previous behavior (all applied by hawks before our time and none by this MT) while ofcourse none of MT has a mere scratch... it really speaks for itself and they will never 'grow out of it'.

This I warned for earlier, so I'm starting to repeat myself I guess... also I need to work for money next so I'll be off... what this comes down to is Professionalizing or not... well, if you go that way that endeavour will drop dead in no time as that is unsustainable. We do not need Professionals at the helm but the good balanced Team we have now, and that is also how Admin sees it.


Lo

#22 Napoleon 1er

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Posted 29 March 2018 - 12:09 PM

Lo

It is fine to reply in public to a question i made in a pm to MT but then please answer the full question. My question was how many people do you need against you to accept to resign? It is not about initial 5 signatures and then 25 and then 50%+1 but at the end what is it the correct number that you need to accept such request to resign by the community? It is not about if the PB clique is right or wrong but about what is the right priority ... is it satisfy Lo's interests or satisfy community's interests? Community interest as far as i understand it is to have a nice and peaceful forum. So if your departure from MT allows this goal to be realized then it should go this way ... even if the continuous pressure from the PB clique is not justified and even if they are all wrong. Interests of the community shall prevail.
Now you clearly deserve all honors for your strong passion, commitment and time you've spent for the good of this forum. I'm convinced nobody will deny that and i want to make sure this is recognized.
I understand this decision is difficult and i fully agree with you we shall oppose any purge of MT. I don't believe it is the case nor the intention of the PB clique but we can let them comment themselves. From what ibperceive the only intention is against you.
Again I'm 100% with you if it comes to defend MT so i propose you one deal: you accept to resign temporarily for 1 month at the condition that afterwards MT will be able to work under normal conditions again. If after 1 month we see that it is still same mess and PB clique attacks other MT members then admin shall give you back your powers and you can flag them all those who are leading the mess, if after one month this forum is peaceful again you will not get your powers back but we will all be happy to have solved the mess, ok for you?
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#23 maxroelofs

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Posted 29 March 2018 - 12:29 PM

Roeczak, libello considers himself independent. According to this logic, it wouldn't be necessary to install a new Dutch mod as replacement for libello.

 

 

Just call him Lonello, let's keep the focus on the arguments.


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#24 Nortrom

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Posted 29 March 2018 - 12:37 PM

Just call him Lonello, let's keep the focus on the arguments.

Arguments and facts aren't very popular around here nowadays. Things like "PB-Clique" and "Dirty crimes" are. Anyway, I'll refer to him as his screenname :).


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#25 KissMyCookie

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Posted 29 March 2018 - 12:46 PM

clique |klēk; klik|

noun

a small group of people, with shared interests or other features in common, who spend time together and do not readily allow others to join them.

 

The term ‘clique’ is misused here. In fact, there does not exist any organized group, no coalition, no faction, no club that is expressing their discontent–there is a collective body of people at large who have similar feelings of unhappiness, discontent, and disappointment. By looping all of these people into a single group and calling them a ‘clique,’ again, it is manipulative, dishonest, and inaccurate. It is designed by the accuser to garner as much sympathy for himself as he is self-portrayed as a victim of a large group trying to overwhelm him. This is false. Based upon the definition of the term, it should be obvious how far off base is the use of the term–just because people share a common ground does not make them a unified group, and there is NO exclusivity to this amalgam of individuals–all are welcome and none are ignored.

 

Best to refer to any of these people, individual or collectively as 'opponents.'


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#26 TheOptician

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Posted 29 March 2018 - 02:52 PM

Lonello,

Suggesting that these cases be handed to admin is an absolute waste of time. Let's look at the big picture. Admin hold the community's only (slim) hope of ever improving the site from a technical perspective. Yet 95% of the communication between MT and admin revolves around minor tasks such as reducing a players ELO by a few points (a temporary and completely pointless action) or activating bans (which can easily be side-stepped). If we wish to stand a hell's chance of ever making any progress I think it is this dynamic which is the biggest hindrance. So you think admin are likely to take the community seriously when we consistently present them with a barrage of insignificant tasks which they can only perceive as annoying at best?

I think you know full well that admin couldn't care less about such petty issues. Sure - if there is some serious breach of duty, then they will likely intervene - as they have done on maybe one or two occasions in the past.

Please do the community a favour and stop bothering admin with the childish squabbles
of the Forum. MT is the spokesperson of the community, and should consider the relationship with admin as an opportunity, not a nanny.

#27 Nortrom

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Posted 29 March 2018 - 03:06 PM

I couldn't have worded this any better myself. In fact, one of the rumours I heard is that admin "left" after MT decided to go against admin decision about a year ago. On the other hand, we have MT members boasting about their great relationship with admin. I'm curious where the truth lies. If the rumour is true, I can only say, good job to you!

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#28 Fks

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 12:07 AM

10 people already voted for his demotion which is more than the 5 necessary to start a procedure. I think MT shall address the issue.

Is this speaking for the MT?
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#29 Fairway

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 01:10 AM

Fairway, he has shown no intention of ever apologising for the things he had done wrong. That is the main thing that irks me.

Exactly, if he does not apologize for his poor decisions and change them, he will need to be removed. 


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#30 Fairway

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 01:13 AM

Thanks Josh.
Anyway the point of my post remains , dutch players.

Tim? Anjo? Hielco?
Edit: Saw Nortrom's post. If no dutch member is required i vote for Fairway.

Thank you :) but..

Fairway is too young in my opinion.

If maxroelofs has the time, he would be a good fit. I also recommend yellowhat. He is young but responsible enough for the role.

I agree, Max would be a better option. And if yellowhat becomes a member of MT I am the only Junior Tournament manager. :) MM would also be a good candidate


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#31 Nortrom

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Posted 30 March 2018 - 09:28 AM

JT / MT combination shouldn't be too much of a conflict of interests or too burdensome. Same for DT(For what its worth) / MT. 

 

I think long lasting combinations of TC / MT  or MT / WCO are undesirable too. Sounds very burdensome, but also, separation of "powers" keep things fresh and hopefully fair.


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#32 Morx

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 12:00 PM

It seems the community has a clear idea about what to do.

 

When can we expect MT to comment on this?



#33 Major Nelson

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 03:23 PM

Somali pirate and ΣΠΑΡΤΑΚΟΣ have only written one or two posts in total. They barely seem to care about this forum, yet they voted for Lonello's removal from the MT as if they've experienced any negative behaviour from his side or are disappointed by his actions. How strange...

Similar case with Perigord, although I admit he has reached 20 posts, so I guess he is relatively more active member of the forum.



#34 Morx

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 03:49 PM

@Major Nelson: I saw you voted, so at least you seem to take take voting and the poll serious. Now also please respect the other voters. Some people write more, others seem to read more.

 

I think half my total number of posts only was made after I started to deal with the Future of MT.

 

Do you want to go over the whole list of voters in an article or do you prefer, like me, to just take the results of the voting and put consequences to it?

 

As in: in the next few days send an AR on behalf of the MT (not Lonello) to the Admins requesting Lonello to join the honorary ranks and thank him for his services? I already offered to open the thread for this in another post.



#35 Major Nelson

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 04:01 PM

@Morx

Anybody has the right to vote. But when I see players who apparently don't care about the forum voting for such an important matter I can't help but find it suspicious. I can't cancel their votes, I'm simply pointing out the surprising fact hoping that sensible players will understand what is going on.



#36 Morx

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 04:12 PM

Well I found it strange that two people that have been defending the most blatant lies, abuse of power and other sillyness as displayed by Lonello, did not vote yet, but I am not complaining about it in the voting poll.

 

I think most people just want answer to one of those questions:

 

-When is Lonello going to take up on Napoleon 1ers offer or

-When will the MT (not Lonello) finally speak out and say: "We listen to the community and we know he has to go. It is clear his very presence is dragging us down and we are sorry we let this continue for so long."



#37 Wogomite

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 04:17 PM

It seems the community has a clear idea about what to do.
 
When can we expect MT to comment on this?

Somali pirate and ΣΠΑΡΤΑΚΟΣ have only written one or two posts in total. They barely seem to care about this forum, yet they voted for Lonello's removal from the MT as if they've experienced any negative behaviour from his side or are disappointed by his actions. How strange...
Similar case with Perigord, although I admit he has reached 20 posts, so I guess he is relatively more active member of the forum.


MN, not sure you really answered morx. It seems you more so dodged his question. Even with what you said being true, there are still 16 guaranteed, unique players that voted yes with only 5 votes a no. Could you please give a more appropriate answer to morx' question. I don't think four votes you can't trust should make a difference with what he is asking.
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#38 Nortrom

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 04:23 PM

@Morx

Anybody has the right to vote. But when I see players who apparently don't care about the forum voting for such an important matter I can't help but find it suspicious. I can't cancel their votes, I'm simply pointing out the surprising fact hoping that sensible players will understand what is going on.

Will you also discredit Smu_QA's vote pro-lonello?

Active Posts 9

 

Let's say you wouldn't count somali pirate and  ΣΠΑΡΤΑΚΟΣ .. it would still be lots of votes against lonello.


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#39 Major Nelson

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 04:26 PM

MN, not sure you really answered morx. It seems you more so dodged his question. Even with what you said being true, there are still 16 guaranteed, unique players that voted yes with only 5 votes a no. Could you please give a more appropriate answer to morx' question. I don't think four votes you can't trust should make a difference with what he is asking.

The post I wrote just expressed a personal opinion, it was not the view of the MT on this matter. We will discuss and offer our opinion as a team.



#40 Major Nelson

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 04:31 PM

Will you also discredit Smu_QA's vote pro-lonello?

Active Posts 9

That is suspicious, too.

Let's say you wouldn't count somali pirate and  ΣΠΑΡΤΑΚΟΣ .. it would still be lots of votes against lonello.

Indeed, several unquestionably active players expressed their disapproval of Lonello, the MT will discuss about their concern.


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