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#261 Unladen Swallow

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 10:31 PM

I know his other account... he's an old player he used to play years ago. 


Edited by Unladen Swallow, 04 March 2018 - 10:32 PM.

I used to play against a few drunken idiots in College and University. I just recently discovered this game online, playing my first matches against real-world opponents. After 100 games, I'm now one of the top 10 players in the world.

#262 steelers

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 10:33 PM

This thread gives me a massive headache.  Here's my 2 cents.  I believe that if someone outside the MT is willing to contribute their time and put in some of the work the MT does (if, for example there were MT elections, and they were willing to run), then they have a legitimate right to call for the heads of the leadership.  But if someone is criticizing, but is unable or unwilling to volunteer their time, they don't have much ground to stand on.  Anyone has a right to give constructive criticism, but those calling for them to be expelled should be willing to step up themselves and donate their time.


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#263 Unladen Swallow

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 10:34 PM

This thread gives me a massive headache.  Here's my 2 cents.  I believe that if someone outside the MT is willing to contribute their time and put in some of the work the MT does (if, for example there were MT elections, and they were willing to run), then they have a legitimate right to call for the heads of the leadership.  But if someone is criticizing, but is unable or unwilling to volunteer their time, they don't have much ground to stand on.  Anyone has a right to give constructive criticism, but those calling for them to be expelled should be willing to step up themselves and donate their time.

 

This thread's a lot funnier if you imagine it as one big soap opera called 'StrategoDale'. They're all actors. 


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#264 Morx

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 11:57 PM

@Steelers: your thoughts sound sympathetic.

That might not make your reasoning right.

I will give you some things to consider:

1 If I would find a judge that was found to be involved in libel and slander cases, abuse of power, would I have no right to complain?

Would you argue that if I would complain about this, I should go to law school and learn the job and do it myself?

2 If I found that a moderator, representing a website, was using dubious methods to deal with negative feedback about his functioning, would I not be allowed to call this out?

Would you argue that if I thought there would be better better candidates  that are actually suited for the job , I should not be allowed to point these things out?


Edited by Morx, 04 March 2018 - 11:59 PM.


#265 Nortrom

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Posted 05 March 2018 - 12:18 AM

Friendly reminder there are still many unanswered concerns.

 

I plead guilty of having given US's post a like, and I hereby also confess of having liked TheOptician's post too (even more!)

 

 

I have thanked you for your effort. The answers given have raised several new concerns / questions which give you / MT the opportunity to clarify a few unclear things.

 

 

 

 

Napoleon,
 
Thank you for answering MJ's questions ( http://forum.strateg...he-mt/?p=448163 ). Based on those answers, I would like to ask you / MT addiitonal questions.
 
"I did revert the three back to ordinary members, so that at least the staff is undivided."
 
1. This is the 3rd or 4th version shared by MT regarding the demotion. May I ask that MT comes up with one final version which we then can consider to be MT's final version of the story?
 
2. Regarding the quoted text. "Staff" is a title given by the forum software. "Staff" should only be Admins and MT. The WCO team(me personally, I don't know about karaiskakis/morx) does not consider itsself part of "staff". Staff is supposed to enforce site policy rules, which is something the WCO team or other bodies are not required to. 
 
3. " there is no need some people conserve powers if there is no wco activity for the next 5 months" may I ask why people with the title 'Dutch tournament managers' still have their status, despite, as stated earlier, atleast two of the not having made a single post for a very long time? please also reflect on why said managers are keeping their status, while WCO does not. Also note, you are calling it powers, I personally see it as a status. The 'WCO online team' status also passively promotes the WCO.
 
4. "you are right but there is the case where Nortrom called MT morons" would you be interested in a list of forum "insults"? that MT has not actioned to show inconsistency about outcries from MT.
 
5. "but we invited them to check the overall situation that is hostile towards MT" Do you agree with me that the "hostile situation" as you call it, is a result of the general unhappiness expressed by many forum members regarding the functioning of MT?
 
6. "We informed them that we believe there is a kind of "organized conspiration" against MT whose only goal is to substitute current MT power by "THEIR power"." Do you agree with me that MT here has used its privileged position having a line of communication with Admin, in order to influence the opinion of admin by stating untrue and negative statements about the "organized conspiration" (just the name alone already achieves this)
 
7. Based on 6. Do you agree with me that influencing Admin's opinion deserves a no-confidence vote? ("substitute" comment and "organized conspiration" comment)
 
7.1 Do you agree with me that "what we did is inviting admins to have a look at what is going on on the forum in general so that they can make their own decisions" and the following statements ( A and B )contradict each other?
 
A. "We informed them that we believe there is a kind of "organized conspiration" against MT whose only goal is to substitute current MT power by "THEIR power"" the two insinuations (organized conspiration) and substituting by "THEIR power" could influence ones supposedly, unbiased, opinion. Do you agree?
 
B. " invited them to check the overall situation that is hostile towards MT" insinuation there is a hostile situation towards MT could influence ones supposedly, unbiased, opinion. Do you agree?
 
8. May I know who mentioned "organized conspiration" to Admin?.
 
9. May I know, from each individual member of MT, who considers there is an "organized conspiration"?
 
10. " People who just visit this forum to have fun would probably quit immediately when they see what is ongoing" do you agree with me that a MT that has been sitting in office for too long with little to no improvements.
 
11. Are you of opinion that members have quit because of lack of improvement from MT aswell as general dissatisfaction about MT?
 
12. "This is not what MT wants and this is not what admins want" what do you think of what forum members want? since you are only referring to Admin and MT's desires. Is the popular opinion of forum members relevant to MT / Admin?
 
13. "Admins told us "Let's think about ways to discourage politics and powerplay on the forum"" Do you agree with me that the demotion of the WCO team was a political action?
 
14. Do you agree with me that many forumers believe that the demotion of the WCO team was a political action?
 
15. Do you agree with me that comments mainly voiced by Lonello make it look like this was a vindictive action? (this renders Lonello illegible to answer this particular question)
 
16. " substitute current MT power by "THEIR power" " May I ask who "THEIR" refers to here? Does this include everybody who has recently said anything that MT does not like?
 
17.  "whose only goal is to substitute current MT power by "THEIR "power" do you agree with me with me that this is a libelous comment and that atleast one who I think refers to  "THEIR" (me) has stated he does not wish a permanent / long term MT position? was Admin informed of this too by MT?
 
18. ""Apart from some responses to measures taken I don't see any complaints about the team in customer care"" can you ask admin / customercare when I will receive a message of notification and a case number regarding my case submitted vs one of the MT members? (wednesday 28th of feb, 11:58 am)
 
19. "frankly speaking I don't think the case against you by US [Unladen Swallow] will be judged differently than any other" do you agree that MJ's statements regarding not having confidence in fair votes in this specific case from several MT members, has merit?
 
20. How does MT feel about forum members expressing the opinion that they do not trust (members of) MT to be able to judge fairly?
 
21. May I know if MT or individual MT members has/have a bone to pick with MJ based on his opinion of MT?
 
22. "WCO members may have issues due to their current hostile behaviour towards MT" do you agree with me that this statement is another veiled threat?
 
For each question asking if you agree / disagree, please also give a rationale.
 
 
 
 
 
 
------
What we see is a hostile behaviour towards MT, I'm sure nobody will deny it. I deny it
 
We perceive that there is a group of people who wish to destroy current MT. This is because MT has grown fond of their position. I don't speak for the group, but I have no destructive intentions regarding MT. In my posts I have clearly stated I want to improve MT.
 
if there is no such organized group against MT please explain what is happening? Please answer my above question who you feel this "organized group" is. I see it as individual forum members who have legitimate concerns about the functioning of MT / MT members. It says a lot that many of those individual members tend to agree on a lot of points, even to the point where MT refers to these individual members as  "group" or even a denigratory term such as "clique"
 
This behaviour which consists in willing to destroy MT without proposing any alternative is not a positive behaviour. I have offered my services for an alternative way but since this offer has not (yet) been accepted, I can not disclose too many details currently. I have stated several things I feel could, should and must be improved. Details will follow when the time is right.
 
So I suggest that instead of focusing on the destruction of MT you focus on the construction of your alternative structure ... be propositive ... who would be this new team, what would be their new tasks, what will be the new rules? Again, I am not focusing on destructing MT and I object to this comment and would like you rectify this. I refer to my earlier answer.
 
from their[sic] we could eventually start to discuss constructively. Just look at the first post of this thread Yes, I also found it unsettling that the topic had shifted away. I would like to remind you that the second post on this topic (from Napoleon) stated "For your information MT has not received any announcement of any dissatisfaction" already shifting away from the topic at hand. Just denying that there are dissatisfied members. This is about the future of the MT and I think the discussion on what kind of behaviour is acceptable by MT is a very legitimate one.
 
the question was about organizing elections for MT, only 1 guy replied and then the whole thing turned into pure vindicative[sic] grievance exchanges with no real benefits except for Netflix. While you may not agree with things being said, the discussion benefits the community. I for one find the demotion of orange team a "vindictive grievance exchange". Many forum members tend to share this opinion. This gives you the opportunity to reflect on https://i.imgur.com/JFsNCRg.png this comment made by you, in name of MT.
 
why don't you just answer the initial question and make some constructive proposals? Could you please state the way the MT has handled my suggestion about for example about the enforcement of ISF anti double-chasing rules? ( http://forum.strateg...ego-game-rules/ ) note there is a poll 24 : 1 in favor. Is this also how MT is going to act upon the survey MT has promised to publish soon? I give you explicit permission to quote from the private conversation between MT + Me about this ISF anti double-chasing PM.
 
I trust you'll be able and willing to address my earlier concerns and questions too. Thanks.
 
Nortrom

 


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#266 Nortrom

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Posted 05 March 2018 - 12:19 AM

Regarding the comment from Steelers

 

I disagree with your statement "But if someone is criticizing, but is unable or unwilling to volunteer their time, they don't have much ground to stand on". This would mean that someone who is not in a position to take on a moderator position would not be allowed to offer his/her sincere thoughts, concerns and suggestions. 


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#267 steelers

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Posted 05 March 2018 - 12:49 AM

   Morx and Nortrom, I said I do believe anyone can offer constructive criticism.  My issue is with trying to remove them without being willing to assume some of the responsibility created by their void.  I don't agree with everything the MT does or says, but I appreciate that they volunteer a great deal of time, much more than I am willing to give.  I can't imagine there is a long line of people who want to be MT's, I know from my own personal experience with the TC and NASF it is difficult to find volunteers willing to give their time. 

   Hopefully cooler heads will prevail and this mess can be put behind everyone and we can work together to make the community stronger.


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#268 Morx

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Posted 05 March 2018 - 01:23 AM

@Steelers:

 

If there is no way for the user community to remove malfunctioning members of MT and they know this, it is easy to get stuck in the chair.

 

In private conversations with various people involved in the Future of the MT I mentioned that malfunctioning members of MT have to be removed first, before other steps can be taken.

 

I put a timeline document earlier today. From this a few points:

 

3 Denial/downplay

-Feedback is used to lower pressure, not to fix issues>

 

The MT Survey 2018 seems a good example of this. MT seems to say: we promise you change in the far future (at the latest 30 April 2018). We need one month to look at the data of 10 poorly formed questions and hope that you forgot what this discussion was about by then.

 

If the last obstacle to change would be willing to step down now - I would offer my help for how long it would take to improve the MT and make it a worthy office instead of a Muppet Court.

 

The other option is for  the other MT members to use the option available in line with 1.4 of the site policy.

 

1.4 Removal of Moderator from Position: For reasons of poor conduct, dereliction of duty, or internal or external conflict a moderator may be removed from his position by either a decision of the Youdagames official representative, Mick Moolhuijsen, or a vote of two-thirds of the current Moderator Team. A moderator may also be removed if the current Moderator Team has at least 5 members, and two polls among the moderators are taken three months apart, with one vote less than two-thirds of the current MT voting each time to remove the moderator in question.


Edited by Morx, 05 March 2018 - 01:24 AM.


#269 scottrussia

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Posted 05 March 2018 - 05:32 AM

Regarding the comment from Steelers

 

I disagree with your statement "But if someone is criticizing, but is unable or unwilling to volunteer their time, they don't have much ground to stand on". This would mean that someone who is not in a position to take on a moderator position would not be allowed to offer his/her sincere thoughts, concerns and suggestions. 

 

The problem with this is that there is very little sincerity being exhibited here.  

 

The owners of the site are free to remove any/all of the MT.  If you really believe someone is acting poorly in the MT then craft a message to the owners of the site and follow up with them.  There is no need for the nonsense we've seen displayed.  Personal grudges, perceived slights, disagreements about 12 ELO points, etc - it all sounds like little spoiled kids picking a fight.

 

All this nonsense just makes it less likely that people will be willing to be more involved in any element of volunteering time towards stratego.  Whether that be as a forum moderator, tournament volunteer, or as simple as forum participant.  Who needs this type of nonsense in their life?

 

If you want people removed from the MT contact the site owner's representative.  


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#270 Morx

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Posted 05 March 2018 - 08:47 AM

@Scottrussia, it you have read the other arguments being made in this thread, you can see that is not about 12 ELO point cases.

 

Without reading back, the issues mentioned at hand mention include

 

- threatening users that give feedback about incompetence (Lonello), clear malfunctioning (Lonello), abuse of power (Lonello), and involvement in a number of libel and slander cases (Lonello again)

 

I am arguing that the respect the users have for the remaining members of MT is actively hurt by him staying where he is. As you can see above  I am willing to work on solutions: "If the last obstacle to change would be willing to step down now - I would offer my help for how long it would take to improve the MT and make it a worthy office instead of a Muppet Court.". 

 

I hereby invite other active members of the community to do the same.

 

Napoleon 1er already resigned. This seemed to be based on accusations made in this thread. If you would have read a bit back you can see that he is linked to (amongst others) Favoritism and involvement in a cover-up where other members of MT (Major Nelson) knowingly acted against the site policy in order to help a competitor.


Edited by Morx, 05 March 2018 - 10:00 AM.


#271 Lonello

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Posted 05 March 2018 - 02:32 PM

People have been asking what I find of the libels and why not open them against, well I'm no dramaqueen - I take the higher ground. Everybody sees through the nonsense and we have an open case review on them (or 'scrutiny' as my colleague said it) so everything is added to that caseload. There's some serious stuff and it's good to have that as things compared are very relative then.

 

I've exposed them 2 days ago, and now to just let them rant is the best approach I find, as they have now only turned frustrated and desperate. Perfect. Strategodale will be over soon.

Some coop all the constant warmongering bad though, as they have harassed several Staffmembers into resignation already. This was after they had, each of them, said from the end of 2017 on to purge us all. This were not mere threats but is now to be seen as action. When asked, they said they were proud to have done it and would do it again, or come on to the next to harass.

There are a lot of personal attacks which is what drives them (just recollect the WP KARAISKAKIS gave Nortrom for abusive, excessive swearing and personally attacks towards other forum writers). Their reputation preceeds them. I stand up against that bullying so it is only natural that they then focus on me. I am outspoken and my goal in life is to do the right thing. I have often said MT-members are not here to make friends. In fact, if we do our job well it would be the opposite sometimes.

What we've got is 5% of the community in heavy protest on the one side and 5% on the other side, just as we see here. We can do only wrong here if we perform our task well as we rule in the middle which makes neither side happy, just more angry. For me, it is toppriority to remain impartial which is why I save a troublemaker from PB the one day, then get backstabbed later the next. This can be even said to be the "Professional" side in me ;). I do the right thing and if irony come serve me later for it, it's all fine. I will only know that I have done my job well.

Since I know their warmongering very well from the past, I for one had already expected this. I'm sorry to see that I've been right but I'm sure the community will overcome this as well. It's important the community knows about their longterm plans and goals... I can make a factual timeline of all their actions to this effect. In the end for them there is only one goal: to destroy Dieter and capture The Stratego World. Yes, that is Strategodale.

Some will not have read all the posts and wonder who this Dieter-chap is. Well, he is totally irrelevant... but for them. For them there is only 1 staggering world: a world Pro Dieter and a world Against Dieter. That last is their final goal. Simply ignore this as it is only extremely vendictive behavior of what they have been through a very long time ago. The major importance is to keep Stratego.com independant and have it not turn into the one camp or the other... this is a place for everybody.

Now their logic in all of this is you get swears at you, harassment at you, vulgarity at you, and a lot more... and mind you, this is Staff attacking other Staff! Then when you so much as mum a rebuttle... do not touch them at all in lights of proper punishment so with clear show of favoratism towards them, some argue... you get case after case in order to finally purge the rest of MT too. Then once in power, this new MT will consist of 5 clones of Sadistic trainees: that new MT can swear along, use pornographic material and vulgarity as much as they want and fully biased warmonger the arch enemy out, for that would be an upgrade from current MT. That is their logic, as envisioned here on the forum. Well, good luck with that.

So what they ploy with purging MT is to seize control and turn this place into that war camp while turning into dictators, as history tells. I will always fight against such behavior with open gard and am proud we have an independant MT now with zero of this ancient bagage they want to bring in. Completely impartial, no alliances. Do I have personal feelings in this? Well ofcourse, as for Morx I've known the man for decades and he used to fight with us against the bullying and kept on the facts. Now he has degraded himself to the factfree standards of the Fake News University.

That pains the eye. As I said I have stopped reading their harassment some time ago already. It's all a farce they come with. Petty and pathetic cases brought for something as using the analogy 'crime' when they use severe swearing themselves and vulgar pictures, again, on none of which they get even the slightest of punishment from us. Nothing. And I for one was strong on that, and also wanted all of the warmongering to remain open on the forum for transparancy, as the community can then judge for themselves.

So that's why I took one's advise and stopped reading (while I ofcourse keep reading the vast amount of other posts of the non-clique) but I trust if they have anything genuine to say, my MT-colleagues will alert me on that, and react as well. I can some already hear, saying "Well that is not professional! You ought to read everything!" And this has precizely been my point all along. It's my point for the last 25 years actually. I 'ought' not to do anything... this is purely a volunteering job we probably spend 40 hours a week on per MT-member with a pay of exactly zero cents for the last 5 years.

The whole point I keep making is there is a genuine goal to strive for Professionalism in Stratego. Fine, strive for it. But I am on the opposite side. The MT-members are nothing more than the rest of us here, they only help out the community where they can, and that is all. That some call me unprofessional I keep as an honorary title. I think it's great and I hope to get such compliments a lot more in the future.


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#272 Morx

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Posted 05 March 2018 - 06:45 PM

@Lonello,

 

There is a lot of "They" and "We" again in this masterwork of fantasy, but what are you accusing ME of?

 

Not "they", not "them", just what did Morx do?

 

If you want more facts, lets go over some facts:

 

Fact 1: I am saying you are not suited for the MT job.

 

If you want to know why, read my earlier posts.

 

The way you are replying to this message is by endless posts with associations to all sorts of things that I have no relation with.

 

Fact 2: I asked you in private to stop lying about Nortrom even before your first post that was handled in "Nortrom vs Lonello 1"

 

In the first post you make in this very thread you come in with guns ablazing and blindly accuse Nortrom this :

 

Post 24 :"First you harass our Greek MT-member last week up to the point he even resigns".

 

I told you in private this was not true. I knew this for a 100 percent fact  because I sent a message to Major Nelson.

 

You just assumed that Nortrom was also involved with this and did not bother to check the facts.

 

14 hours after telling you this, you still took no action to rectify this.

 

In post number 25 of this thread Nortrom demands rectification:

"I demand an immediate, public rectification of this 100% pure bs, preferably in a seperate thread pinned for a week in the general forum."

 

I think there will be a case coming against you for this soon.

 

Note that the word harassment was also based on incomplete fact checking. This might have been how Major Nelson perceived it, for me it was just a hard slap on the hand to someone i felt should know better. If MN does not object, I am willing to put the whole message up for the public to see.

 

You also implied that you did not SEE the message. A good judge would

1: check with the counterparty to get their vision of the story

2 Try to check the actual evidence (the message in question)

 

Instead you hit Nortrom with it on a public forum.

 

I will leave it to the audience to draw their own conclusions about your competence here, let alone your manners.

 

Fact 3 I do not swear at you in my posts, I am just giving you other sort of feedback that you do not want to hear


Edited by Morx, 05 March 2018 - 07:07 PM.


#273 TheOptician

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Posted 05 March 2018 - 07:05 PM

well I'm no dramaqueen - I take the higher ground


And how well your next 1000 words proved your point...
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#274 Napoleon 1er

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Posted 05 March 2018 - 07:28 PM

Friendly reminder there are still many unanswered concerns.

already answered here: http://forum.strateg...he-mt/?p=448220

 ... come with concrete proposals first then we talk


If you don't know where you go ... you have a lot of chance to arrive elsewhere ...

#275 Unladen Swallow

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Posted 05 March 2018 - 07:43 PM

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#276 Napoleon 1er

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Posted 05 March 2018 - 08:17 PM

see my comments in blue below:

 

@Steelers:

 

If there is no way for the user community to remove malfunctioning members of MT and they know this, it is easy to get stuck in the chair.

 

In private conversations with various people involved in the Future of the MT so you are talking of all the various actors of Strategodale, right ... I would be very interested to read from them directly what they think form your attitude in this opera?I mentioned that malfunctioning members of MT have to be removed first, before other steps can be taken.

 

I put a timeline document earlier today. This document you refer to shows exactly who you are and what your real intentions are .... pure destruction of MT, strictly no constructive proposals for alternative if necessary, delighted in his macabre goals ...From this a few points:

 

3 Denial/downplay

-Feedback is used to lower pressure, not to fix issues>

 

The MT Survey 2018 seems a good example of this. MT seems to say: we promise you change in the far future (at the latest 30 April 2018). We need one month to look at the data of 10 poorly formed questions and hope that you forgot what this discussion was about by then.

 

If the last obstacle to change would be willing to step down now - I would offer my help for how long it would take to improve the MT and make it a worthy office instead of a Muppet Court.

 

The other option is for  the other MT members to use the option available in line with 1.4 of the site policy.

 

1.4 Removal of Moderator from Position: For reasons of poor conduct, dereliction of duty, or internal or external conflict a moderator may be removed from his position by either a decision of the Youdagames official representative, Mick Moolhuijsen, or a vote of two-thirds of the current Moderator Team. A moderator may also be removed if the current Moderator Team has at least 5 members, and two polls among the moderators are taken three months apart, with one vote less than two-thirds of the current MT voting each time to remove the moderator in question.

 

 

@Scottrussia, it you have read the other arguments being made in this thread, you can see that is not about 12 ELO point cases.

 

Without reading back, the issues mentioned at hand mention include

 

- threatening users that give feedback about incompetence (Lonello), clear malfunctioning (Lonello), abuse of power (Lonello), and involvement in a number of libel and slander cases (Lonello again)

 

I am arguing that the respect the users have for the remaining members of MT is actively hurt by him staying where he is. As you can see above  I am willing to work on solutions: "If the last obstacle to change would be willing to step down now - I would offer my help for how long it would take to improve the MT and make it a worthy office instead of a Muppet Court.". 

 

I hereby invite other active members of the community to do the same.

 

Napoleon 1er already resigned. This seemed to be based on accusations made in this thread. absolutely not .... all accusations you've made about favouritisms have been proven to be wrong as you can see from this post. http://forum.strateg...he-mt/?p=448004 Nobody replied to it so clearly nobody has objections to this simple explanation based on logic and facts. Your accusation is wrong and may have confused some of the readers. They can see now who you are in reality ... a little boy spreading out fake accusations and savouring imaginary success from believing he can destroy MT. Most people had a positive impression from you in the past but now i guess you have lost a lot of credibility on this forum, only due to your vindicative, destructive, hostile and not at all propositive attitude towards MT ... but I don't need to say that, every reader is intelligent enough to understand and make their own opinion ... I resigned first because after 4 years it is time to let the place to a new generation (by the way MT is looking for a successor so if there are interested people you can contact MT through pm, those days we need people able to resist strong pressure) and because this allows me for more freedom of speech, no need to coordinate first my answers with MT, I'm now allowed again to tell you exactly what i want, when i want and how i want .... i guarantee you will love it!    If you would have read a bit back you can see that he is linked to (amongst others) Favoritism and involvement in a cover-up where other members of MT (Major Nelson) knowingly acted against the site policy in order to help a competitor. there is no competition within the little stratego world. WHoever is supporting and promoting stratego is welcome. We shall not have only 2 but 10 ... what am I saying we shall have 100 stratego websites if we want this game to become greater and greater. Your ridiculous antigravon attitude is another thing that makes you lose credibility. I'm telling you that in all frankness to help you. Try to construct stratego of the future and work together WITH the others not against them! ... we need all stratego fans to support us in this direction not just some egoistic elite!


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#277 Nortrom

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Posted 05 March 2018 - 09:51 PM

already answered here: http://forum.strateg...he-mt/?p=448220

 ... come with concrete proposals first then we talk

Napoleon,
 
In the chat we had recently on stratego.com after your announcement of resignation, I had shared some of my idea's (under embargo). Whether you agree with them or not does not mean I did not share some of my idea's with you. I also mentioned that it is pointless to share those publicly as it will only start debates on little details. I trust that you can confirm this.
 
You know the prerequisite is lonello's resignation and that I do not wish to burden new people on the job with having to deal with his constant negative presence to the point they get drained out. I trust that you can confirm (some of) my statements and that MT can proceed to answering the questions.

Edited by Nortrom, 06 March 2018 - 12:11 AM.

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#278 Napoleon 1er

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Posted 05 March 2018 - 11:16 PM

 

Napoleon,
 
In the chat we had recently on stratego.com after your announcement of resignation, I had shared some of my idea's (under embargo). Whether you agree with them or not does not mean I did not share some of my idea's with you. I also mentioned that it is pointless to share those publicly as it will only start debates on little details. I trust that you can confirm this.
 
You know the prerequisite is lonello's resignation and that I do not wish to burden new people on the job with having to deal with his constant negative, nagging presence to the point they get drained out. I trust that you can confirm (some of) my statements and that MT can proceed to answering the questions.

 

ok, so if your objective is clear and now transparent for everybody (I've highlithened it in blue  above) I don't think you need all these answers to all your questions anymore, they are useless. What i propose is that if the above goal is exactly what you want then why don't you just try to apply the proposal we've made in our survey "removal of a mod by the community"? This would facilitate a lot the dialog as it is respectful of the rules (even if not yet formally accepted as new clause in the forum rules, at least MT will not be able to disagree with it as we did precisely propose it) and would avoide all this Strategodale and hostile harassment.

MT does  have a procedure to remove a mod by MT but if we are not willing to apply then nobody can force us to do so. Our current MT is a strong team showing solidarity to each other. Even if we have had ups and downs between us sometimes it doesn't mean we are not able to work together ... I should say TOGETHER. This is the most important competency somebody need for joining MT ... team spirit. 


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#279 Nortrom

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Posted 06 March 2018 - 12:09 AM

I refer to my Strategodale post from earlier : http://forum.strateg...ire-department/

 

Spoiler
 
This survey will take atleast until the start of april. Let's say MT tries to fight off the "Worse service than Dutch Railways" award and, let's be generous, the survey result is released at april 20 (45 days ). Then add a week (7+45=52) for the proposed procedure. "This poll will remain open one month, unless the issue is decided before that time" means that in a very positive scenario, it would take 53 days from now on to achieve this. In a bad case scenario, it could take up to 82 days from now. I don't know if you read the concerned Strategodale citizen's post, but he wants a new house and he wants it now.
 
--
 
I've explained to you why I think it is vital that lonello steps down. You know this guy drains your energy with his never ending negative presence, fallacies and lack of logic and I do not wish that new members of MT have to endure this.
 
--
 
"MT does  have a procedure to remove a mod by MT but if we are not willing to apply then nobody can force us to do so. Our current MT is a strong team showing solidarity to each other. Even if we have had ups and downs between us sometimes it doesn't mean we are not able to work together ... I should say TOGETHER. This is the most important competency somebody need for joining MT ... team spirit.
 
" Of course not. How this looks in practice, lets use mod A, B, C, D, E as examples.
 
E shares his intent with C to vote out mod D.
C doesn't like this idea and tells D that E wishes to vote him out. 
D gets furious and starts attacking E
A and B both don't like D but neither are willing to open the vote themselves as they fear a 3:2 vote
 
Yes, you are right that teamwork is essential. So is being honest and saying goodbyes to a not functioning member. It is highly egoistical that one, unfit, stays and drags the team down.
 
 
EDIT: I have expressed, several times
""I also like to bring out my earlier statement again to show that I am more than willing to take upon a task: "I hereby in front of all (forum)members, promise, that when Lonello steps down, I will gladly take upon the opportunity to, temporarily, take over his badge and will do everything in my power to improve the quality of the MT and restore trust from the community. ""
 
Questions remain open

Edited by Nortrom, 06 March 2018 - 01:13 AM.

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#280 Unladen Swallow

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Posted 06 March 2018 - 12:17 AM

moved to the other topic, it is more appropriate there


Edited by Unladen Swallow, 06 March 2018 - 01:29 AM.

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