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Gun control in US


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Poll: gun control (private poll) (11 member(s) have cast votes)

Should there be more gun control in the US?

  1. Yes (10 votes [90.91%])

    Percentage of vote: 90.91%

  2. No (1 votes [9.09%])

    Percentage of vote: 9.09%

  3. I dont know (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

Should automatic waepons and "launchers" be forbidden for normal citisens?

  1. Yes, both should be illegal (5 votes [71.43%])

    Percentage of vote: 71.43%

  2. No, only rockets and other very explosive guns should be illegal (2 votes [28.57%])

    Percentage of vote: 28.57%

  3. No, only automatic waepons should be illegal (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  4. No, both should be allowed normally (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

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#61 Napoleon 1er

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 01:18 PM

You are right Gary. The original americans (except the native indians) were all high liberty fans with anticonforming opinions who escaped from Europe where their ideas weren't accepted. Among these people who escaped from Europe you had for example:

- all people who were rejecting the very conservative catholic church domination. That is why in USA you have that many evangelic communities or sects ... in America they found new spaces where they had freedom to exercize their different beliefs
- some adventurers/conquerors/entrepreneurs who were pissed off with the very conservative habits and closed minds that were leading the European culture with very little open-mind for new things. In America they found new spaces and freedom to realize their desires and ambitions. That's why in USA you are much more business oriented and don't look at failure as a catastrophy but rather as an opportunity to stand up again. This is the origin of capitalist predominant spirit in USA.
- people who have been judged as criminals or have tried to make their own justice in Europe who get banned and were unable to re-insert themselves in the society. They found in America some spaces where nobody knew them as criminals and could rebuild their life in freedom. That is probably also the origin of this "loaded gun at home is freedom" mentality that most americans share

Etc...
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#62 Fairway

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Posted 01 December 2017 - 10:38 PM

 It shows American kids watching the vid and there are also a couple of Republican kids in there. Probably the ginger boy is Fairway. 

Is that an insult?  :P 


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#63 DarthRemark

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Posted 02 December 2017 - 02:56 PM

Is that an insult?  :P

I think so.  ;) 



#64 Lonello

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Posted 02 December 2017 - 02:57 PM

Certainly not. Don't you like ginger hair or muscled athletes? That's what that bloke has and is. He won't be mocked, that's for sure, so it's a compliment to Fairway :blink: B) :)


Lo

#65 Fairway

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Posted 02 December 2017 - 05:10 PM

Certainly not. Don't you like ginger hair or muscled athletes? That's what that bloke has and is. He won't be mocked, that's for sure, so it's a compliment to Fairway :blink: B) :)

No no Lo, not about hair, but "Republican kids" , although to be accurate that would be "Conservative kids" anyway  ;) 

 

(as GOP is nearly as bad as the Democrats, if not as bad, now)


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#66 Lonello

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Posted 03 December 2017 - 11:45 AM

"Conservative kids"

Oh right, yes, that is what your doppleganger is. Soon he'll play in the NFL. And you can be certain he will sing the anthom there, Fairway. Trust me. He will. True story.


Lo

#67 TheOptician

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 08:54 AM

27072889_2244186912258941_61067157670082

b13qZvjYuOXoYHGXER86xBz-X2kCfZ3EqHeQC3bA

What will the US ban first. Lawnmowers or beds?
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#68 Unladen Swallow

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 09:07 AM

How can someone die by falling off a bed? Unless said bed was precariously placed on top of a cliff. 


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#69 TemplateRex

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 01:22 PM

Without a gun you will one day have to eat the poison jam from some Jack-booted thug pointing his gun at you. With a gun you can postpone that date.

 

You really think that small-scale armed resistance is effective against state-level tyranny?

https://en.wikipedia...iki/Putten_raid

https://en.wikipedia...i/Ascq_massacre

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lidice



#70 GaryLShelton

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 02:32 PM

You really think that small-scale armed resistance is effective against state-level tyranny?
https://en.wikipedia...iki/Putten_raid
https://en.wikipedia...i/Ascq_massacre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lidice

.

TemplateRex, the examples you give from WWII are horrific and sad. Would small arms resistance be effective against the focused might of the state? Of course, the only way it would be is if the antz were to overrun the grasshoppers. All I ask you is when the day comes to your village and they want to carry you off, would you like to be able to have at least a small say in the matter? If not, that's fine. Everyone should have his own choice. If I can only put up futile resistance, don't disallow me my choice.

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#71 TheOptician

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 02:41 PM

>would you like to be able to have at least a small say in the matter?

No, I'd sacrifice this 'say' for the greater good. This really is a tremendously weak argument.



#72 TemplateRex

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 03:05 PM

.

TemplateRex, the examples you give from WWII are horrific and sad. Would small arms resistance be effective against the focused might of the state? Of course, the only way it would be is if the antz were to overrun the grasshoppers. All I ask you is when the day comes to your village and they want to carry you off, would you like to be able to have at least a small say in the matter? If not, that's fine. Everyone should have his own choice. If I can only put up futile resistance, don't disallow me my choice.

I wonder, how many American citizens stand their ground and put up armed resistance when their immigrant neighbours are being deported by federal ICE agents? You can argue about their legal status but remember that the racial segregation, confiscation, deportation and finally extermination during the Nazi reign, were (at least in the first stages) also supported by legislation.

Tyranny is best checked in the early stages: honest elections, free speech and free press. And holding even the highest officials to the rule of law. In the endgame, it's impossible to defend against.

So having firearms, especially automatic assault rifles, has only downsides. The 18th century muskets could fire 3 rounds per minute, not per second.

Edited by TemplateRex, 17 February 2018 - 03:06 PM.


#73 GaryLShelton

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 03:42 PM

TemplateRex, yes history records the frog was boiled bit by bit in Germany. This group, then that. I don't disagree with you in some part. I think in the final analysis we're not engaged with forces of this world but spiritual powers in dark places. Guns expressing more darkness are hard to acknowledge as positives. But here we are in this world. It is what it is.

There is a device that the powers that be are using against the people that is far older than the musket. And they've had centuries to hone their power at this point. One of the most famous people of all time, Einstein, called it the most powerful force in the universe. What's that?

Compound interest. And by close extension fractional-reserve banking. Nothing will be "honest" as you imagine with elections, the press, and free speech as long as this beast roams the Earth.

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#74 astros

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 05:59 PM

27072889_2244186912258941_61067157670082b13qZvjYuOXoYHGXER86xBz-X2kCfZ3EqHeQC3bA
What will the US ban first. Lawnmowers or beds?

  

I agree with your point, but your infographic conviently leaves off 9/11.

How can someone die by falling off a bed? Unless said bed was precariously placed on top of a cliff.


This applies to old people who fall and cannot get help.

.
TemplateRex, the examples you give from WWII are horrific and sad. Would small arms resistance be effective against the focused might of the state? Of course, the only way it would be is if the antz were to overrun the grasshoppers. All I ask you is when the day comes to your village and they want to carry you off, would you like to be able to have at least a small say in the matter? If not, that's fine. Everyone should have his own choice. If I can only put up futile resistance, don't disallow me my choice.


Then do not disallow me the choice to drive on the highway after 10 beers.
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#75 Napoleon 1er

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 07:07 PM

guns are not the problem, ammunition is not the problem, mentally disabled people are not the problem but when you have all 3 of them combined together then you have the problem. The problem of USA is that they do not have a procedure to control the combination of the 3. In Switzerland we control ammunition strictly so no mentally ill person can get access to ammunition, for guns everybody is free to have as much as he wants. In other countries they control guns, ok. Main risk of the 3  above is mentally ill people because nobody can be sure that all mentally ill people are registered somewhere ... if they don't visit a doctor to get a diagnostic they may never be identified as mentally ill, so if a country leaves freedom to buy both guns and ammunition and is not sure to have all mentally ill people registered they have this risk that all 3 get combined at some time. This is i guess a weakness in USA rules. If you want to let freedom to anybody to have access to guns and ammunition then you need to establish a rule that everybody shall present a recent medical certificate that he is not mentally ill, which means that before beeing allowed to buy either guns or ammunition a person need to go make a check up at a psychiatrist. It's the only viable solution, either you control guns or ammunition or you oblige people to present a healthy psychiatric certificate.


If you don't know where you go ... you have a lot of chance to arrive elsewhere ...

#76 Unladen Swallow

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 07:35 PM

We shall never forget... the 9th of November..

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#77 Fairway

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Posted 18 February 2018 - 12:14 AM

I wonder, how many American citizens stand their ground and put up armed resistance when their immigrant neighbours are being deported by federal ICE agents? You can argue about their legal status but remember that the racial segregation, confiscation, deportation and finally extermination during the Nazi reign, were (at least in the first stages) also supported by legislation.

Tyranny is best checked in the early stages: honest elections, free speech and free press. And holding even the highest officials to the rule of law. In the endgame, it's impossible to defend against.

So having firearms, especially automatic assault rifles, has only downsides. The 18th century muskets could fire 3 rounds per minute, not per second.

 

You really think that small-scale armed resistance is effective against state-level tyranny?

https://en.wikipedia...iki/Putten_raid

https://en.wikipedia...i/Ascq_massacre

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lidice

Take a look at the Middle East. The U.S. can barely extinguish sporadic terrorists driving rickety trucks. This can be effective to some degree.

 

And remind me again of one of the first things Nazi Germany did to secure their power? Oh, that's right, they took all the guns from the citizens. How convenient.


I'm always a winner- win or lose the game. I take my mistakes and learn from them!

-Fairway, December 2015


#78 Unladen Swallow

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Posted 18 February 2018 - 12:29 AM

do you seriously think a few people with guns can overthrow an entire govt, fairway? lol


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#79 TemplateRex

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Posted 18 February 2018 - 12:37 AM

Take a look at the Middle East. The U.S. can barely extinguish sporadic terrorists driving rickety trucks. This can be effective to some degree.
 
And remind me again of one of the first things Nazi Germany did to secure their power? Oh, that's right, they took all the guns from the citizens. How convenient.


Resisting an occupying force is feasible to some extent, but only if that force considers itself bound by the rule of law. The Nazis didn't, and their collective punishments against whole villages crushed most resistance. It took the biggest land army in history to wipe them out.

#80 Fairway

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Posted 18 February 2018 - 12:57 AM

Resisting an occupying force is feasible to some extent, but only if that force considers itself bound by the rule of law. The Nazis didn't, and their collective punishments against whole villages crushed most resistance. It took the biggest land army in history to wipe them out.

Yes in the case of Nazi Germany this is true. But remember the Nazis did their best to take all the guns away from their citizens, so the resistence was likely muted at least to some extent. It's also an example of what taking away guns can do, Nazi germany recognized this a something they needed to do in order to stay in power (meaning that it can make a difference!)


I'm always a winner- win or lose the game. I take my mistakes and learn from them!

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