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Should the NASF offer rewards to their members?


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Poll: Should the NASF offer rewards to their members? (11 member(s) have cast votes)

The NASF is considering asking members to pay $10 per year which will cover the cost of trophies and other prizes for our members based on performance in tournaments. Please give us your opinion

  1. I would be happy to support the NASF and contribute $10 annually knowing that money will be used for tournament awards and that no committee member will profit from this. (5 votes [45.45%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 45.45%

  2. I think the NASF is fine the way it is, with no awards. (6 votes [54.55%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 54.55%

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#1 --Wogomite--

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Posted 16 April 2017 - 12:07 PM

The NASF committee has decided to take a vote to see if members would be willing to donate $10 a year to allow for awards to be offered. This poll is to determine if we would be able to realistically raise enough money to offer prizes. 

-The NASF committee



#2 scottrussia

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Posted 16 April 2017 - 12:46 PM

I don't see any real benefit to an award.  We are playing merely for enjoyment and/or pride...... ie bragging rights.  And on a practical note, I think you've greatly underestimated how much you'd need.  Not to mention all the effort to set up an account and chase down folks to make their payments.

 

And if we did offer awards then we'd have arguments over how many to give out :) (Spartan Warriors aren't big fans of participation awards).


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#3 queenbee1

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Posted 16 April 2017 - 07:16 PM

I am on the other side obviously. I wouldn't chase someone down for 10.00. It would be voluntary.

 

"Honey I won the tournament" 

"Oh really what does that mean?"

"Well it means I have bragging rights"

"Go back to sleep"

 

I think right now in some of your lives it just doesn't matter, but as you get older those memories are golden and you have nothing to show for it. Why do competitions give out medals and trophies? Golf and football started small and players are forgotten. Bragging rights? To whom?You wife and kids? Your friends who don't even know what Stratego is?

 

All real events have trophies and green jackets or the Superbowl rings etc and behind them are organizations. These awards are something special to be cherished in our elder years when the forum and perhaps Stratego is long gone. A memory of an event can be forgotten, but a medal or trophy is your representation of belonging to something. 

 

How many players do we have in the NASF? About 12 players on a good day? How many players has anyone brought to the game? I am constantly selling players to join. Do you? There is a general feeling of laissez faire. How much do you think a medal costs? I can tell you about 5.00 at 15.00 per tournament we only have about 4-5 tournaments a year. That is plenty of money. We could make them nicer if Americans saw value in belonging to the NASF. The future is ours to mold.

 

One day you will be old like me and I have regrets. I no longer have the golf and billiards trophies that I didn't see any value when I was young and now there is no one left to brag to. Nothing but a memory. When you are young you think your will live forever, but it comes at you fast.

 

I pushed for this idea and then I realized what I was up against. Why should I join a club that has people who organize and run the tournaments for me? I can buy a big mac, fries and a coke for lunch instead.

 

Member support is infectious. It motivates you and us to bring in new members. I remember Robert De Niro played Al Capone in The Untouchables and he talked of his enthusiasms. What was his? Baseball. So he is walking around the table talking to his capos and saying "when a man steps up to bat it is time for individual achievement. In the field without the team who is he? No one." So we are a team or we are no one.

 

Capone is not a man to emulate, but the writers were correct. We survive as a team or we are no one. When we play it is mano y mano, but the NASF needs a reason to grow and prosper or we die. I have had a long life with many "Enthusiasms" This is me on my soapbox hoping to convince someone to change their vote. Stratego is my enthusiasm.


Edited by queenbee1, 16 April 2017 - 08:54 PM.


#4 Bill0nStrateg0

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Posted 17 April 2017 - 03:17 PM

no



#5 despy

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Posted 17 April 2017 - 06:31 PM

I haven't been around here that long, but frankly I don't see what the NASF adds on top of the standard gameplay on this website that would merit a membership fee. I suppose it all depends on what the goal of the NASF is, but if that goal is to bring together as many North American players as possible into some sort of sub-community, I think a membership fee moves against that goal.

 

Some may say trophies/prizes may attract more players, but I think whatever additional participation may come from those hoping to win a $25 prize would be far outnumbered by the players not wanting to spend money on the site (myself included). If you accept that proposition, then a further impact of this reduced membership is that in the world team championships, you're pulling from a smaller pool and potentially not having the best players represent the region.

 

Ultimately it comes down to the value proposition of the membership fee - for example, if this restructuring required a membership fee to support the setup of regular tutorials/mentorship to help players improve, that would be a different story, and certainly something I'd consider vs. paying as a contribution to a tournament prize pool.



#6 --Wogomite--

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Posted 17 April 2017 - 08:27 PM

Even Maxroelofs is willing to donate $10 to help pay for something he will not even benefit from :)


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#7 josephwhite

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 04:56 PM

I'm ambivalent. I don't mind contributing to the NASF if it will help it grow in some way or another. However, at the same time, I'm not personally motivated by cash awards in tournaments.

 

On a related point, but just a thought and I'm not sure if it really has any merit. If we ever got a dominant player in the NASF that was active, like Hielco or Nortrom, it might be discouraging to keep contributing to their winnings all the time. Fortunately, we don't seem to have a dominant NASF player at this stage, although constrictor could be if he were more active.



#8 queenbee1

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 06:51 PM

I would like to say once again that it doesn't matter now, but it will matter when you get older and are sitting with your grand kids and saying Daddy used to play Stratego. I got this for the tournaments I played in. If I thought throwing money at the NASF would result in more players I would, but it won't. What we need is an influencer. If every player got just one friend or family member playing it would double the membership. Then ask them to pay it forward. Nothing for free is worth belonging to. That is why country clubs are exclusive. Why people go to sporting events and sit in private boxes or at the top of the stadium or arena.

 

If I paid someone to give lessons on Skype you would say you don't need lessons or a hundred different reasons you don't have the time. Stratego is a game that can be played, but not conquered. The problem is that we don't tell our friends and family. They shrug at the very idea of the game, but if you said you played chess they might think better of you. Hey Bob get your clubs and let's go down and play a round. Or a tennis racket and play a set for drinks. Same idea goes with everything in life. 

 

"It's not what the NASF can do for you. It's what you can do for the NASF." because the way things are going it is not promising. How many time you've been online and asked someone to join? My guess is 0. So how does the committee get players? We don't. We have nothing to offer in exchange for membership. I personally think it should be 100.00/year. Then you can expect something back from us. Even 100.00 is not a lot of money. The fact is the members value Stratego at 0 and they get back 0.

 

My tournament is a perfect example of reward vs nothing. I got the top players in the game based on name recognition? My reputation? No I got them because they have for a long time played and got nothing.

 

Can you imagine group lessons on Skype? You might even be teaching the noobs. Maybe this was just a waste of my time typing all this out, but it was my time and I love this game.


Edited by queenbee1, 22 April 2017 - 10:55 PM.

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#9 --Wogomite--

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 09:42 PM

I do want to put my two cents in and also support the idea of making this something more than a random thing that fills our time with no reward. I don't do very many things half hearted, if I do something, I want it done the best that it can be done. Right now, I can't seem to find anybody who cares about Stratego. I am constantly telling co-workers, family members and friends about the game and only one has had a presence in the rankings and is a member of the NASF (silent slayer). Most of the time nobody sees the points in my passion. ( I am currently working on my aunt  :) )

 

I am very seriously considering posting an add on craigs list that says something along the lines of:

Stratego Tournament Here! Free entry, $20 reward to the champion. All are welcome! I have about 4 or 5 boards so I think I can make it work.  I am going to put in my own $20 just to promote the game and if it is successful I plan on doing it again and again and again. It is worth the small amount of money to get others to experience the beautiful game of Stratego as I have. 

 

We here on the forums already have this luxury free of charge, why are we so reluctant to offer something so minimal as $10 a year just to support the promotion of this sport. I believe that one day this game could make it to the Olympics but if the people who are already playing it does not find it important to support any means possible of promoting the game then why would the Olympics find it important to accept it? For this game to make it to the Olympics, 80 different country's will need 200 supporting members per country and were in. Why can't we dream big and watch it happen? Ten dollars is not the point, the treasure that it brings is our motivation. Even if you don't love the idea of giving financially, would you be willing to do it anyway? I give you my word, if we find enough positive voters to agree and move forward with this idea, I will double the amount of money we have suggested and give $20 every year. Let's start a very fierce fire that takes off across the world. Let's give others a reason to join our cause. Let us be a revolution that people will talk about!!...but it starts with you. Don't fight against it, understand it and then fight for it. 

 

If you voted no, would you be willing to change your vote to yes?

If you have not voted yet, would you be willing to support us with a yes? 


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#10 Fairway

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 10:54 PM

I do like the idea of rewards, I really do (although Fairway will never get one  :(  ). However, I think the NASF needs to focus on getting more members rather than handing out rewards. I most likely would not mind paying 10$ a year for the NASF or www.stratego.com, really. 100$ is way over though, Queenbee, what is a simple hobby for most (me included) should not require a payment of $100.


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#11 --Wogomite--

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 11:19 PM

I do like the idea of rewards, I really do (although Fairway will never get one   :(  ). However, I think the NASF needs to focus on getting more members rather than handing out rewards.

I can honestly say, offering rewards will definitely get others interested that would otherwise find no benefit in participating. For example, if I did not have Stratego as a hobby and someone told me that I could learn to play a board game, sign up for tournaments and win something that I can show people, I would probably have jumped on board. Rewards are a great incentive to get new members for the NASF which in turn would bring the numbers up for TC and the WCO. 



#12 despy

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 04:25 PM

[if] someone told me that I could learn to play a board game, sign up for tournaments and win something that I can show people, I would probably have jumped on board

 

I would think that anyone with such motivations already knows that chess is such a game, except on a much larger scale. Many more resources to learn from, many more opponents, many more prizes and prestigious titles to be earned. 

 

The prospect of prizes getting Stratego players interested in tournaments - completely valid.

 

But the prospect of prizes getting random people interested in Stratego? Much more unlikely to me. Aside from perhaps the World Champion title, which is of course incredible in anything, the world of Stratego is a long, long way from having anything as prestigious as something like FIDE Master in Chess. 

 

Would you rather learn a game that everybody knows, most can play, and can earn you millions per year? Or one that is underlined by your spell-checker every time you write its name in a forum post? (Take a guess at which is Chess, which is Stratego)

 

One could argue that Stratego has a more convenient (online) medium for winning trophies, or requires less work than Chess to learn enough to win a trophy, etc... happy to address why I think these are null points, but a tad out of scope for this post -

 

Anyways, a long blurb, but my point is this: Stratego's low profile means that the type of players it can attract are those that are simply interested in the game for what it is, not for potential prizes. The amount of money that each member of the NASF would have to donate to overcome this, in my opinion would exceed even Queenbee's enthusiastic suggestion of $100. 


Edited by despy, 26 April 2017 - 04:27 PM.


#13 Unladen Swallow

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 04:49 PM

I wouldnt pay $100 just to enter a stratego tourney



#14 --Wogomite--

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 04:56 PM

How did we go from giving 10$ a year to 100$ for a tournament....???


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#15 The Prof

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 05:17 PM

Right, the poll question is for $10 a year, and I see Fairway said this:

 

 I most likely would not mind paying 10$ a year for the NASF or www.stratego.com, really. 

 

So would you consider changing your vote?  :)


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#16 Unladen Swallow

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 05:32 PM

Queenbee and others were talking about increasing the fee to $100 instead of $10, though I do understand the poll is for $10 only. 

 

My vote remains the same. I do not see the incentive in paying to enter a tournament or paying for a yearly membership. Besides, having a fee to join discourages those less skilled from taking part. Why would a silver spy pay $10 a year to join tournaments full of platinums when they have no chance of winning? 


Edited by Unladen Swallow, 26 April 2017 - 05:32 PM.


#17 --Wogomite--

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 08:20 PM

My vote remains the same.

Your not even an NASF member...I'm confused with your involvement here

 

 I do not see the incentive in paying to enter a tournament or paying for a yearly membership. Besides, having a fee to join discourages those less skilled from taking part. 

We are not planning on making this an obligation to participate as an NASF member, the idea is for donation only. If one does not choose to donate, that's ok. We simply wanted to see if enough players would donate 10$ a year to make awards possible. 



#18 Unladen Swallow

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 08:27 PM

Your not even an NASF member...I'm confused with your involvement here

 

Lonello and Maxroelofs aren't NASF members either and they also voted in the Poll.  I am still allowed to voice my opinion on this despite being a non-member as it's a public post. Many will agree with my views on this.  


Edited by Unladen Swallow, 26 April 2017 - 08:49 PM.


#19 Fairway

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 09:41 PM

Right, the poll question is for $10 a year, and I see Fairway said this:

 

 

So would you consider changing your vote?  :)

I think the NASF needs more participants and a wider variety of skill levels (Not just top plat to low gold, ahem ahem Fairway, ahem) before they should focus on handing rewards. I most likely wouldn't have a problem with paying $10/year to get progress of the NASF, but don't want them to spend it on rewards, not yet. The question in the poll:

 

I would be happy to support the NASF and contribute $10 annually knowing that money will be used for tournament awards and that no committee member will profit from this.                  


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#20 queenbee1

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Posted 27 April 2017 - 05:51 AM

There is simply no way to make an organization be fair to the lowest common denominator. Why should anyone play at all? What is the motivation? Why go to work if you don't get paid the same as the high performers? Bronze player have no interest in tournaments. They don't even know where the forum is. Everyone has a right to an opinion, but in all fairness this poll should be limited to NASF active members only. If the NASF wanted to accept contributions from its members it is difficult as the TC offer the same product for free.

 

As an example I am a hard worker who owns and builds a small business and a huge corporation decides to offer the same services through predatory prices and I will go soon out of business. This is a problem within the culture of online gaming in general, but also exists with videos, music, books and anything that is considered IP.

 

The internet has created a culture that presumes that everything is free. You can go to the movies or download the movie and watch it on TV. You cannot walk out to a golf course and play on it just because you have a bag of clubs. A paid membership has its privileges. I have noticed that many players have no commitment and when held to standards are quick to complain or simply leave.

 

I can go on and on why organizations should be supported, but why? It won't change the culture of free.


Edited by queenbee1, 27 April 2017 - 05:55 AM.





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