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increasing number of players use memorizer tools


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#21 trickz

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 02:36 PM

Nee, dat is een apart deel van België.
Compleet met eigen bevoegdheden, eigen regering enz.
Vlaanderen, Wallonië, Oostkantons,....België heeft officieel ook 3 gesproken talen.
Je hebt hetzelfde in Zwitserland bijvoorbeeld,....Italiaans, Frans en Duits.
Hier dus ook :)
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#22 vowles_23

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 02:39 PM

Nope. As I see it, the memorizer is a standalone application since it can apply a complete overlay over the screen. A web-based flash-applet (like Stratego.com) is unable to influence a users computer in such a way, since then it would be really really easy for a programmer to hack any system. This is only possible if you install stand-alone applications at driver-level (kernel-level) on each PC this site is to run. Examples of such software are STEAM from Valve and Ubiplay. But even those can be fooled again by other software, and so on and so on.

 

If the memorizer is webbased though, it would be possible, since every installed add-on or toolbar is identifiable by  any website.

 

Ah, well I didn't really look at the link very thoroughly. I assumed that it was a web add-on in your browser. Shame that it ever got invented really.


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#23 Enigma

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 02:49 PM

Cheaters will find a way to cheat, regardless of the method.  Cheaters need to be dealt with, but that's a different issue.  What matters is making sure we don't ruin this great game with a "remain visible" option.  "Remain visible" is NOT Stratego, and should not be offered on Stratego.com.  Don't ruin Stratego.  Keep the game pure and true.  Thank you.


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#24 varishnakov

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 05:11 PM

I agree. One stratego site I went to before coming to this one had so many diferent game options  and custom settings I literally could not find a regular stratego game to play.


I have quit the site until the cheating players are dealt with.


#25 vowles_23

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 06:13 PM

I agree. One stratego site I went to before coming to this one had so many diferent game options  and custom settings I literally could not find a regular stratego game to play.

 Haha I've been on that one. Pretty difficult to understand.


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#26 NTactical

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 08:04 PM

Haha I've been on that one. Pretty difficult to understand.


Metaforge?
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#27 Lord_AvS

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 09:59 AM

The beauty of this game is that the pieces remain unknown and you can shuffle pieces so your opponent gets confused. That part of the game, to remind the other pieces or make your opponent confused, is for me the best part of the game. I didn't knew this kind of program exist but it would be hard to do something against players who use it. Despite that i would be against the proposal to make pieces visible after discovery.


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#28 trickz

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 01:56 PM

I agree. One stratego site I went to before coming to this one had so many diferent game options  and custom settings I literally could not find a regular stratego game to play.

That's exactly the reason why I don't like Metaforge.
I used to play there too but all those options, settings, notifications and so on drove me nuts.
I just like it clear and simple without all the added BS.
That site only got me confused, it just wasn't fun.
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#29 vegas

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 11:06 PM

I play for fun and I don't care about my rating or rank.  In fact, I wouldn't care if they got rid of the ranking system all together.  This would give people less incentive to cheat, but on the other hand, having rankings or rating keeps people interested and playing.

 

I will never cheat.  I just plan for the fun of it and I enjoy the challenge of playing a stronger player.  I like to try to guess my opponents pieces, and sometimes strategically bluff.  

 

Play for the love of the game.


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#30 HmmNess

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 11:59 PM

This type of system is whatever in my opinion.  We can't do anything about people using 3rd party software or 3rd party instruments.  This is a weakness in the game that can never be fixed when computers are used to play Stratego.

 

In old war times, Commanders use paper to mark where their enemy is or where they have been.  In my opinion, marking locations with paper or whatever is not cheating, since in a real war, using paper to remember where a conflict occurred is beyond reasonable and is needed if you want to be victorious.

 

I know that the tournament officials do NOT allow paper or any instrument that allows players to map out their enemies setup.  That being said, I still have no problem with people marking what pieces I have moved or what pieces I have not moved.  I look at the game of Stratego as a war simulator.  You are a commander in this war simulator and it is reasonable to have your own map or drawing beside you in order to track your opponent. 

 

Computers just add to the level of tracking which could make things a little unfair, but like I said before, I don’t have much of a problem with this.  You are never going to stop people from writing things down or creating scripts that allow them to track your pieces.  More importantly, we need to focus on issues that can be fixed, such as glitches that can be used as exploits to win.

 

HmmNess


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#31 Midnightguy

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 04:07 AM

Hmmness I would consider using any tools to help memorize where or what your opponent has as cheating....UNLESS if BOTH SIDES openly agree to take notes.  I would also say that if both sides to agree to take notes, you are taking much of the challenge of the game away. 

 

One thing that a few players probably do offline while playing a game here and I would also consider cheating is, to use a Stratego board game to map where what pieces are where once discovered.  The major part of this game is to memorize what you discover and play your game from there. If your opponent can map where all your pieces are at once they are discovered, this will remove future bluffing in the game.  Even the sharpest minds on here, won't remember every single piece they discover every game.  Anyway, I don't use anything but my mind to memorize, move, capture, and bluff my way to a win or loss.  I would hope most players are the same as me. 

 

I know this won't be added to our game, but a true way to test a players ability of this game is to not show what captures have been made.  Easy to remember if you capture a Marshall or General but what about how many Captains?  Did you capture all of their scouts?  Is it safe to move your Spy around?  Remember if you got all of his bombs?  If I do play offline vs my friend, once we make a capture, we lay the pieces face down.  Makes it more challenging and a true test of our ability.


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#32 vowles_23

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Posted 28 February 2013 - 02:29 PM

Metaforge?

 

Yeah. :D And congratulations on making silver! You too HmmNess!


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#33 GOD OF WAR

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Posted 28 February 2013 - 02:57 PM

it is irritating that some players would go that far just to cheat i just don't see the point of it , and why would they want to cheat , just to be in the silver . It just disgusts me


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#34 HmmNess

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Posted 28 February 2013 - 07:24 PM

Thanks a lot vowles, just staying there is a pain though.

 

HmmNess


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#35 trickz

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Posted 28 February 2013 - 07:45 PM

Thanks a lot vowles, just staying there is a pain though.
 
HmmNess

Tell me about it,....it's just impossible :)
If you want to be a stable silver guy, you need to strike at least 75 procent if not 80 procent.
One giant loss and it's all done.
I know for sure that I'm gonna relegate a hundred times from silver to marshall and back again.
Perhaps if you can get with a little bit of luck to 650, that you can stabilize your silverstatus.
But yeah, I ain't such a genius unfortunately.
But I'll be back in the silver league, sooner or later :)
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#36 SuperDrew2k

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 08:44 PM

the majority of the world would actually rather play this game with remain visible...most things evolve with time...its not a law to keep things the same just for the sake of tradition. some people think its a crutial factor, to memorize the position of 10 or more pieces at once....for others it is a big burdan that takes away from the fun of trying to capture the flag. i think the stubborn veterans of this game have really hurt stratego from prospering.    


Hmm....i wonder where that marshal went

#37 trickz

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 08:50 PM

the majority of the world would actually rather play this game with remain visible...most things evolve with time...its not a law to keep things the same just for the sake of tradition. some people think its a crutial factor, to memorize the position of 10 or more pieces at once....for others it is a big burdan that takes away from the fun of trying to capture the flag. i think the stubborn veterans of this game have really hurt stratego from prospering.

Lol. Statement of the century I guess :)
Ridiculous of course.
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#38 SuperDrew2k

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 09:09 PM

Lol. Statement of the century I guess :)
Ridiculous of course.

-->everybody<-- i have ever introduced the game of stratego to, would much rather play without memory.

 

the other main stratego site out there, is currently dying due to lack of players. most of them blame the "crazy" options...but truth is that the pure players refusal to play with remain visible (and other fun options) are to blame. most of the paying members there prefer to play with RV turned on. and that is not a just a "statement"...it is a fact


Hmm....i wonder where that marshal went

#39 HmmNess

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 09:19 PM

In tournament play, players must reveal and then hide their pieces.  It keeps things more competitive when you hide your pieces.  In a friendly (Non-Rated or Ranked) game, it would be fine to allow a permanent reveal.  But, all rated games should go by tournament rules and keep the game as strategic as possible.

 

You can even look at it this way:  This site is geared towards serious players.  If an un-ranked button was added, you could have your extra options.  Hell, I want the Infiltrator Piece added to the game.  Yet, I highly doubt the Infiltrator will be used in Ranked games, even though I believe this extra piece makes the game more strategic.

 

To Keep Reveal pieces in Stratego would almost be like allowing Kings to move as many spaces as they wanted to like the Queen piece in Chess.  It really changes the game big time.

 

HmmNess


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#40 Designated Baby

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 09:22 PM

I agree. If it isn't broken, don't fix it. Plus, that would make it a lot worse.


gg





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